# Lowest cost AHRS EFIS/6 pack replacement?

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#### PagoBay

##### Well-Known Member
From earlier in this thread. FYI...
I was a mechanical design engineering in the medical and aeronautical fields for ~35 years (including engineering management). The quality of the mechanical engineering in all of the MGL equipment that I've seen is... what's the word... terrible. PC boards unsupported by anything other than the soldered DB-15 connector; PC boards floating inside plastic housings, etc. Not to mention that their US support was one guy, so if he gets run over by a bus... They've just started using a distributor, but who knows how that's going to go. Then there's the terrible UI in their iEFIS system; the software that works sometimes, and the RDAC engine monitor that we couldn't get to work even with the one support guy telling us that we had hooked everything up right with his help.

Now, I've never seen a Vega unit. Maybe they're a lot better than the previous generations. I don't know. But I wouldn't bet MY $on it until I'd seen one, disassembled it, and tried it out. And then get a Garmin, Dynon, or some other vendor's product. #### cluttonfred ##### Well-Known Member HBA Supporter The MGL and Kanardia solution are, I think, better as primary than as backup systems. If your problem is electrical then another electrical gauge will only be helpful if on a separate electrical circuit and power supply, adding complexity. A small mechanical or battery-powered altimeter could be a useful adjunct to a mechanical LRI or ASI though personally I would be less concerned about the altimeter for day VFR flying. #### 12notes ##### Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter Log Member The MGL combo AVS2$455 (2020) combined with the AHRS-4 $795 (2020) =$1250 for daytime VFR add a compass altitude encoding output available if you plan to add a transponder in the future. Quite convincing. I use the EFIS extream only as a EMS so if starting over I would elect the EMS-2 $455 (2020) and the$200 8 channel RDAC slave to a master warning light to draw your attention to the EMS if needed. "extra eyes". 3 holes + a Magnetic compass and done for daytime VFR. $1905 + compass and engine sensors my experience with the MGL EFIS is quite solid! Instead of the MGL AVS2 & AHRS-4 for$1250, you could just get the Garmin G-5 (experimental) for $1289, and reduce it down to 2 holes. If you sprung for the optional magnetometer, you wouldn't need a spot for the magnetic compass either. #### 103 ##### Well-Known Member Instead of the MGL AVS2 & AHRS-4 for$1250, you could just get the Garmin G-5 (experimental) for $1289, and reduce it down to 2 holes. If you sprung for the optional magnetometer, you wouldn't need a spot for the magnetic compass either. Wow that is a deal! Even the magnetometer is "reasonable" I did not know that "experimental" version existed, even my cartoonishly large slip ball could go be redeployed. Looks like a back up battery could be integrated. I will review deeper tonight! #### rv7charlie ##### Well-Known Member Dynon & GRT both make similar feature-rich small screen EFISs, at about the same price. As a bonus, they're not Garmin. ;-) If you add moving map, the updates are free, too. (as in, not Garmin) #### PagoBay ##### Well-Known Member Speaking of GRT... Levil Aviation has an app that accepts their data. Not sure about which GRT unit. And don't understand how the app and hardware interface. The Levil Aviation app is free and looks quite robust. They call it a "Wireless Glass Cockpit" on your iPad or phone. Level Aviation adds that they have a patent pending wireless autopilot feature coming. #### 12notes ##### Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter Log Member Dynon & GRT both make similar feature-rich small screen EFISs, at about the same price. As a bonus, they're not Garmin. ;-) If you add moving map, the updates are free, too. (as in, not Garmin) Maybe I'm missing some available products from these manufacturers, but as far as I can tell, the available options from Dynon and GRT are either considerably more expensive, lack provisions for air data, or both. Please let me know if I missed something, I've got some decisions on my panel to make soon. Dynon D10 has pitot/static ports as well as GPS, but costs$2200; the $880 D3 is a GPS based device, with no pitot or static ports. GRT Mini GA 4.3 is$1650 and is also GPS only.

A quick look around on Aircraft Spruce found these two, I haven't compared features, though:
Uavionix AV-30-E uses pitot/static and GPS, but costs $1600. But it is the best looking in my opinion. Likewise, the MGL Extreme Mini is$1300 also has pitot/static and GPS.

#### rv7charlie

GRT Mini X is $1395 direct from GRT; has pitot & static built in. The AHRS (attitude) solution doesn't depend on GPS or air data. (Many others do; worth researching if you plan IFR flight.) There are extra cost options for AOA, moving map (free database updates), autopilot control, etc. And it's not Garmin. ;-) edit: The reason the Mini GA doesn't have air ports is because it's intended to go in certified a/c, without STC/etc, like a portable GPS. It snaps into a mount that just happens to fit over a standard 3" instrument hole. Only required connection would be power, which could come from an accessory power (cig lighter) jack. However, it does have the moving map included as a standard feature. I've got one I bought used, in my RV6; quite useful for the map feature and the 'save your bacon' utility if you mess up around clouds, since it isn't dependent on GPS or air data to tell you up/down/sideways. You're probably right about the Dynon; I quit paying a lot of attention to them when I switched to GRT in my RV6. They used to make the D6, which I think had pitot/static. Last edited: 103 #### 103 ##### Well-Known Member Maybe I'm missing some available products from these manufacturers, but as far as I can tell, the available options from Dynon and GRT are either considerably more expensive, lack provisions for air data, or both. Please let me know if I missed something, I've got some decisions on my panel to make soon. Dynon D10 has pitot/static ports as well as GPS, but costs$2200; the $880 D3 is a GPS based device, with no pitot or static ports. GRT Mini GA 4.3 is$1650 and is also GPS only.

A quick look around on Aircraft Spruce found these two, I haven't compared features, though:
Uavionix AV-30-E uses pitot/static and GPS, but costs $1600. But it is the best looking in my opinion. Likewise, the MGL Extreme Mini is$1300 also has pitot/static and GPS.
I have the extreme mini but only use it as a EMS- Very good at that. Gets crowded with flight data. That said when my original ASI went out I was happy to have it althugh I woudl have not troble flying outside the window back to home base in daytime VFR without a ASI. I ocassionlly use the VSI to trim level flight the last 1/6th turn on a long leg. The Talos app works surprisingly well with my Samsung S9 internal sensors. If I buy the box I would have 3 altimeters and 3 ASI, 2VSI .... Talos Avionics – Flying has never been safer!

#### 103

##### Well-Known Member
Talos is gaining mind share. Thank you to Matthew Long for pointing this out and being constant thought catalyst! I find the manuals deficient in specification details like weight, energy requirements... but like many on this list when they engage them on on email the response has been detailed and useful. Putting EFIS TA on top of AVARE offers the least disruptive way to add a horizon and bonus DG to my panel without spoiling the panel I really enjoy. For Daytime VFR I fly I am "OK" without a backup Gyro! Another bonus is I may be able to calibrate the Talos Magnetic Reference better than my Vertical Card Compass.

Final Edit: While I enter the last phase of thinking about it... This youtube is hard to see but impressive Talos Horizon can recover in other than Straight and Level I also added a picture of my Proof of Concept 12/4/20 flight almost looks like I planned for this.. AHRS is in a good sight line but a Non Op App only to prove my AVARE map was still usable with only 1/2 tablet. No real issues identified airport plates cannot be seen without zooming around but you are on the ground when they pop up. ~approximately a 15 mile radius around my plane is very legible using 1/2 a Samsung 8" TAB A

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