Winter depression anyone?

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Well-Known Member
Nov 9, 2009
salt lake city Ut
Re R12: Isn't it funny that R12 was the best refrigerant and we needed it and it was patented... and then the patent expired and all of the sudden it was bad and we needed something else (R134) which doesn't work as well but has a brand new patent?


Exceeding the legal fun limit on a regular basis!

Just for kicks one day I filled two balloons, one with my mouth and the other with R-12. Dropped them and the R-12 hit the ground like a brick. Now how is something much heavier than air punching holes in the Ozone? More Gore Bull? I am no chemist but I smell a rat.

The new refers with 134 don't cool worth a darn that is why they are going to propane. How many children will be blown to bits for Uncle Al's carbon credits?
Well, The chemistry that does in O3 (ozone) works on solid surfaces. How many clouds do you see way up there? Ya it really worked out well for Du Pont, didn't it. Imagine that. I am really tired of government for the few and screw the rest. (Join the PPP penny pinching people's party) Blowing up kids so that Du Pont can make a profit. Hmm. Ford Pinto?


Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2009
Rotterdam, Netherlands
Some random observations:

CO2 levels tend to correlate with global temperatures, yes... but correlation is not causation. Actually, the best picture we have right now is that CO2 levels follow temperature... meaning that high temperatures cause the rise in CO2 levels, not the other way around.
Excellent point. In a comparable discussion a couple years ago I showed the number of Black Americans at university during the years and the global temperature since 1950. The correlation was stronger than with the CO2 levels and my point was suddenly very clear :gig:
The really nasty nuclear wastes have a fairly short half life. Lock 'em up for a few years and they're not that dangerous any more. For the lower activity, long half life ones, it's simple: Cast 'em into glass blocks, stack 'em in an unused corner of desert somewhere, and surround them with a fence and signs, "IF YOU CROSS THIS FENCE YOU WILL DIE". Some people will ignore the signs. Think of it as evolution in action.

Or drop it into a subjection zone in an ocean trench... but someday we may want that stuff (gasoline was once considered a dangerous, useless waste product in oil refining).
Well, with the techniques currently used you need a couple of decades to make it almost harmless and a couple of hundred years to bring it back to the radiation levels of the original ore.