Crashes in the News - Thread

[Hephaestus]

Probably because they're old and paid for, and cheap to run. And the Hawks are needed for training.

Canadair (mfg) has been gone since 86, so we've been hand making all replacement parts ever since... Maybe it's good training for the maintenance guys for battlefield repairs but - I can't see that making much sense...

1962-3 the airframe was brought into service. Apparently in 2022 we're planning to refit the aircraft and extend it out to 2030+. Just for the snowbirds.

DNDs argument is the tutor is more suited to small airfields. But when did they last do a show at a field that couldn't accommodate a CF18?

Not sure, it's interesting politics...

 

[Toobuilder]

Aerostar misfueled

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.avweb.com/aviation-news/misfueling-likely-cause-of-recent-aerostar-crash/&ved=2ahUKEwjy16aw9qDlAhVuHjQIHYTHDtcQFjAPegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw2uM5-pd-7nAI0--4G9dU9A

 

[bmcj]

Aerostar misfueled

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.avweb.com/aviation-news/misfueling-likely-cause-of-recent-aerostar-crash/&ved=2ahUKEwjy16aw9qDlAhVuHjQIHYTHDtcQFjAPegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw2uM5-pd-7nAI0--4G9dU9A

Layers of mistakes combined with pilot inattention. So many red flags that this should never have happened.

 

[Toobuilder]

The pilot was reported to be an accomplished A&P/IA and a detail freak.

Also, in a strange twist, it turns out the pilot was involved with a multi- party deal to purchase my L39. I had the deal locked up, then the guy gets killed.

A small, sometimes tragic world indeed.

 

[BBerson]

Why would the FBO employee ignore the decal and fill it with jet fuel even if the pilot requested jet fuel?

 

[Toobuilder]

And why would he defeat the nozzle restrictors?

This guy worked hard to get it wrong

 

[Vigilant1]

Ahh, human communication. I made it a point to restate what my boss was asking me to do, especially if it seemed like a bad course of action.. Yes, sometimes you have to be willing to look like a simpleton, and you can't be a wiseguy about it. But it is way better to invest 30 seconds at that time than to have yourself (and those who work for you) doing the wrong thing for weeks. Or cause a crash.
The line guy, or his boss, should have had that pilot put his request in writing. That would have gotten his attention.

 

[Wanttaja]

We don't know the experience level of the lineman; we don't know how, exactly, what the pilot said to him. I can think of combinations of experience and pilot attitude that could have resulted in this, especially if coupled with an outside distraction.

Ron Wanttaja

 

[Toobuilder]

I agree with you with the stipulation that pumping gas is not a complex process and there are not a lot of rules to learn. #1 should be to NEVER defeat a nozzle restrictor without being absolutely certain why. ANY level of experience should have that down pat on the first hour of the first day on the job.

 

[BJC]

As a former line boy, I can tell you that many pilots just said “Top it off” or “Fill it up” then walked away without giving a thought to their responsibility for proper refueling. Many even said something along the line of “Check the oil and bring it up to full, if needed.” Then most get in and go without even checking the fuel caps, much less the oil dip stick.

Sure, the line boy made some serious mistakes. But the pilot did not fulfill his basic responsibility.


BJC

 

[BBerson]

Pilot inattention is common, so it falls on the fuel seller. That's why the fuel company is likely to get sued.
Can't sue a dead pilot.

 

[wktaylor]

In the 1980's one of our T-37B landed at a naval base. The aircrew requested refuel and gaseous-O2 [GOX] refill.

The T-37 has a WWII low pressure O2 system [thin wall steel/strapped O2 bottles, 500-PSI MAX, for battle damage]. The sailor servicing the T-37B, didn't bother reading the inter-service manual with data for transient USAF Acft, and instead, got creative and found an adapter for his high pressure [1500-PSI] GOX servicing equipment to match with the T-37B GOX low pressure refill port. I think You can see where this is going.

It was estimated that the [2] GOX tanks ruptured-simultaneously at about 1000-PSI, severing the aft fuselage and injuring the mechanic. Thank God there was no fire.

 

[Toobuilder]

Back when I was in the USAF there was a safety bulletin floating around concerning servicing of tires. Apparently a Crew Chief used the high pressure N2 cart to service the nose tire of an F-15. The resulting explosion essentially tore the kid in half at the pelvis and threw him against an adjacent piece of ground support equipment. The pictures were completely uncensored and graphic beyond any horror movie.

 

[wktaylor]

Military and transport Acft have really high pressure tires [300-to-500-PSI]. In the USAF Mishap world we treat inflated/damaged tires as rubber-bombs... just waiting to catastrophically blow-out and kill some one... until safely deflated... even days/weeks after the mishap.

NOTE.
All high pressure tires and hydraulic accumulators should be serviced with nitrogen. Hot/outgassing rubber [locked/dragging brakes]... or over-heated hydraulic hydrocarbon fluids... combined with high pressure 'air' [~35% O2 @+500-PSI or @+1500-PSI] can make a terrible [chemical] detonation. Nitrogen servicing eliminates this detonation hazard and gives the tire/system the opportunity to safely vent-off pressure [blow-out valves/plugs]; and/or the time to cool down.

Another sad safety lesson...
In the late 1990s or early 2000s, a mechanic was working on a running CFM56, without an inlet screen. I'm unsure if the fan-cowl was open or closed. In a moment of inattention another mechanic running the engine [cockpit] 'wicked-up' the power AND the mechanic next to the engine 'edged' into the inlet 'stay-out - danger zone'. The mechanic was sucked forward to... then around the inlet lip... into the fan-disk. As a mishap investigator, doing occasional work on fighter engines, 'a friend' sent me the photos... and yes...

The pictures were completely uncensored and graphic beyond any horror movie.

I did everything I could to suppress the digital photos... but somehow a few managed to circulate a while back.

 

[Hephaestus]

https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/229517

Narrative:
A Zenair STOL CH 701 advanced ultralight, was conducting a VFR flight from Gimli, MB to Riverton, MB. While enroute, gusty headwind conditions were encountered to the point where the aircraft was moving backwards in relation to the ground and was losing altitude. As power lines were underneath the aircraft, the pilot lowered the nose in an attempt to avoid them. The aircraft subsequently stalled and struck the terrain below. The pilot sustained minor injuries and the aircraft
was destroyed.

Not even sure where to go...

 

[Voidhawk9]

Hmm, something does not compute with that one. Headwinds do not cause an aircraft to lose altitude. Lowering the nose will not induce a stall..!

 

[Hephaestus]

28mph is stall so... 28mph headwinds...

So engine issues perhaps? It will cruise 70s so im a bit befuddled.

 

[Voidhawk9]

The aircraft flies relative to the air not the ground, so wind is not a factor in the stall.

Quite possibly the strange sight picture of the terrain going the wrong way led to pilot miscontrol; it happens from time to time in strong winds, usually at low level in the pattern.

 

[leifarm]

Hitting lee side rotor from a hill or mountain in strong winds simultaneously loses you speed and altitude. It can sometimes feel like the air just disappeared and you are free falling.

 

[RSD]

Any word on why the Snowbirds Tudor pilot needed to eject?