Decalage angle

Discussion in 'Aircraft Design / Aerodynamics / New Technology' started by Eugene, May 29, 2017.

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  1. Jun 16, 2019 #1061

    Eugene

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    They talking speed of 500 MPH!!!!!?????
    At that speed this prop will get 0% airflow!!!
    The clearly know something we don't! And they have much better sponsor than I have!!!
     
  2. Jun 16, 2019 #1062

    akwrencher

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  3. Jun 16, 2019 #1063

    Doggzilla

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    Honestly, since their advice conflicts with other engineers (one who hold a world record) the only thing you can do is test.

    It doesn't take much. Literally anything that moves the drag forward of the wing will work. Even a plastic barrel. When I say anything I mean anything. As long as it can be secured safely.

    It doesn't have to be any more aerodynamic, just shift the pressure forward.

    That will quickly determine how much interference drag you really have while leaving the parasitic drag mostly intact.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
  4. Jun 16, 2019 #1064

    Eugene

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    It is very interesting to me how they think. They split this in 3 ways:

    #1 - ultralight world of 65 MPH = nothing to worry about. You can do anything you want.

    #2 - LSA world of 100-120 MPH - 100 HP, needed different thinking. If you don't pay attention to details = your creation will fly like Skyboy only 80 MPH and you will not make any money.

    #3 - Speed world/world record 160-220 MPH = every little thing can have very big effect on your performance.

    #4 - All you need is $$$$$$$$$$$$ money!!!
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
  5. Jun 18, 2019 #1065

    Eugene

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    Pretty soon my Skyboy will like Pokemon

    m4MKc%eUQRu1ti%wgwBeaQ.jpg wsuWj+RyTciXa6sDQPmDHg.jpg Ka+9wSpFTz+QSiIWS1qQkQ.jpg HHvT8aG2T+qA7ViJIXZNgA.jpg C+NVYRYQQOy1i6r3L6SK0A.jpg
     
  6. Jun 18, 2019 #1066

    Eugene

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    Icon-Update.jpg

    I was thinking, looking at this picture, that engine cowling can be made as one unit, that you will be able slide in from the front. It will hug wings on top and bottom, but only for about 2" or so. This way it will not brake away in flight. What we have on this picture , is non- removable or maybe structural part. I think.
     
  7. Jun 18, 2019 #1067

    Doggzilla

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    That looks great, and will assist lift due to its shape.

    But if you want to do a test to see how much interference drag is present you can test with anything that extends the drag forward.

    And I would definitely add hidden nylon straps, as they are about 100kg/cm strength. Loss of new components is very common during tests. Lots of cowling suffer vibration failures. If the mounts become loose for any reason the nylon will catch it before the prop.
     
  8. Jun 18, 2019 #1068

    Eugene

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    I love to do experiments, as you know, but not sure that I have clear picture in my head about how this supposed to look like. Sorry! Pictures working better for me than words.
     
  9. Jun 18, 2019 #1069

    Eugene

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    Screen Shot 2019-06-17 at 21.48.33.png

    So, fuselage shape on the bottom looks like my Skyboy! So, nothing wrong with this approach ?
     
  10. Jun 18, 2019 #1070

    BBerson

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    The Skyboy fuselage is much lower below the wing.
     
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  11. Jun 18, 2019 #1071

    Eugene

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    Yes, I see that, and they use T-tail.

    Screen Shot 2019-06-18 at 10.46.31.png
     
  12. Jun 18, 2019 #1072

    Doggzilla

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    The issue is that it's wide and flat. It probably won't add more than a few knots depending on how much drag is actually from that or if it's interference drag from the landing gear or engine.
     
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  13. Jun 18, 2019 #1073

    proppastie

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  14. Jun 21, 2019 #1074

    birdus

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    Have you thought about the Osprey 2? George Pereira's designs are fantastic.

    https://www.ospreyaircraft.com/osprey.htm
     
  15. Jun 21, 2019 #1075

    BBerson

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    I like the Osprey 1.
    But I have an Avid Amphibian kit to finish instead. And a pusher of my own design to finish.
     
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  16. Jun 21, 2019 #1076

    Eugene

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    I did looked at them all for education only. They all look cool to me. But for some reason I never want to lend on the water. Someday I will be looking at my Skyboy and I wouldn't know what else to do. Then I will look at different airplanes. But that is not going to happened for this year. On top of that turning around and start going another direction will cost more money. I will play with what I got.

    This time at Oshkosh I will be going around trying to find cool looking horizontal tail for me to copy. For next winter project.
     
  17. Jun 21, 2019 #1077

    Eugene

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    Here is another question:

    On passenger side window I taped small level that represents 4° AOA to the bottom of the wing. With decalage of 6° and 80 MPH I know for sure now that AOA = 4°and horizontal stabilizer at negative 2°. But elevator depending on CG location anywhere from neg. 5°to neg. 7°.
    They tell me that stabilizer at 2° is perfectly normal, but elevator at 5-7° is telling us that this area needs attention and improvements.

    Things that will improve horizontal tail effectiveness on Skyboy:

    - clean up airflow from fuselage

    - increase horizontal tail volume to 0.45 - 0.5

    - convert flat deck to symmetrical 8% - 10% airfoil


    Did I forget anything?

    Screen Shot 2019-06-20 at 22.22.28.png Screen Shot 2019-06-20 at 22.20.45.png Screen Shot 2019-06-20 at 22.18.43.png
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  18. Jun 21, 2019 #1078

    Eugene

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    fullsizeoutput_1743.jpeg

    Was flying today, but really didn't feel difference at all. Elevator position about the same as well.

    fullsizeoutput_1744.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  19. Jun 21, 2019 #1079

    BJC

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  20. Jun 21, 2019 #1080

    Aesquire

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    Kitplanes magazine,July & August issues, have Wainfan's "Wind tunnel" articles on tail size & CG limits. Might be worth a perusal for you.
     
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