Building from scratch a dream

Discussion in 'Bush / Float flying' started by Norm Langlois, Feb 9, 2019.

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  1. Feb 14, 2019 #41

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    Its hard not to go to far in the future trying tell this story as a time line. After adding the new rear float system. I had been taking the plane to a lake, trying hard to get it to fly. That is the time line of Norms flying boat and the discussions with members ,here and the EAA's forums where I post near identical . To shorten up those difficulties . Many suggestions were implied ,and applied. from insufficient elevator size to an improper hull. In fairness I listened . The truth just turned out to be something else insufficient elevator travel. was not discovered until , summer 2017 test flights while trying to get a more reasonable take off.
    In 2012 I had resolved the problem by adding lift spacers under the leading wing mounts . They increased the angle of attack to something within that then elevator travels limit.
    I was still not happy with things in 2012 and after . I chased after one thing or anther with worsening results. Much flying time was lost as a result. Though every plane has improvements that can or should be made. The biggest problem was weight gain and water weight gain. The changing weight also added to the lift off problem to the point that it became unable to fly after landing with a hot engine . A wind became needed after that. I need to go back now to explain other changes before covering the plane.
     
  2. Feb 14, 2019 #42

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    After removing the Torque tube warp and still chasing weight factors I had decided to change out the wing tip option,for a Hornier style rather than the dam style. this was a good and lighter option. second cut template has a secret.jpg blocks of 2lb hot wired and shaped mold blanks 100_0896.jpg I then cut them into sections so removal would be easier wingtip 065 (3).jpg my first attempt at vacuum bagging the results were still very light made from kevlar I added some foam ribbing before applying the to the wing . Unfortunately, that was not sufficient when covering and shrink was applied those actually beautiful tips crushed and rippled. dihedral wing  and plane 014.jpg new tail finished plane 002.jpg
     
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  3. Feb 14, 2019 #43

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    After removing the Torque tube warp and still chasing weight factors I had decided to change out the wing tip option,for a Hornier style rather than the dam style. this was a good and lighter option. View attachment 78269 blocks of 2lb hot wired and shaped mold blanks View attachment 78270 I then cut them into sections so removal would be easier View attachment 78271 my first attempt at vacuum bagging the results were still very light made from kevlar I added some foam ribbing before applying the to the wing . Unfortunately, that was not sufficient when covering and shrink was applied those actually beautiful tips crushed and rippled. View attachment 78273 View attachment 78274
     
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  4. Feb 16, 2019 #44

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    The V tail was not really much to it, it was made from the T tails stabilator. The undesirable effects , Where as the plane was on step it built speed rapidly but yawed and dipped the wing mostly to the right, If I remember,correctly. I was not confident in my assessment of why. So I decided to do the tail over that winter. The vertical and to a mid stabilator . The best part is I learned to make sharp nose bends, without cutting down the flanges. Instead the flanges are flattened.This is one for the stabilator at about 1/4 radius. new ribs (2).jpg By also flattening to specific radius It accommodates a spar tube. new ribs (3).jpg This next one is for the ruder new ribs (4).jpg This is also when I realized I could use 1/2 inch polystyrene fill for strength. new ribs (7).jpg I thought the ribs for the stabilator and vertical would also benefit structurally from a filled rib. new rib style 002.jpg new rib style 007.jpg One can even bend a rib sideways as seen in that last photo.
     
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  5. Feb 24, 2019 #45

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    tail3.jpg tail2.jpg detail of the control horn and bearing. The tail has a stabilizing wire encompassing 360 at the pivot point. from the boom over the top of ruder and back down to the boom . There is a photo without it. I must have applied it after. here is a good photo before the support wire was installed. new tail finished plane 036.jpg See also how low in the water the plane sets with no pilot. water would enter the boom and run back into the cockpit when boarding.
     
  6. Feb 24, 2019 #46

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    The above still photo is shortly before it flew for the first time. There was another great struggle for building the plane. That, was transporting it to the lakes. Though I used the same trailer . It was modified several times. Handling the plane was a 2 man job. That would not work ,in the end it would need to be a stand alone. the earliest was a ramp system. Very unstable. The Finished Airplane 010.jpg Used only when it was a V tail. I made a lift gate from a I/O boat hydraulic trim system. This was much better . Handling was now 1 man but still unstable. It required an addition to the transfer cart. The original was a cart that was used to handle the plane from garage to water. Still in use it required a variable in elevation . This was done with gas struts to the carts front wheels.When extended or compressed it would need to be locked or an undesirable compression or extension could occur. Would change where the wing tip elevation was for getting into the 9 ft garage door. trailer and wheel mod 002.jpg new tail finished plane 014.jpg
    I forgot to lock the extension one day and as I rolled the plane back onto the lift gate,one wheel compressed and the plane threatened destruction by rolling of the trailer and down into a road side ditch. If it where not for a lady jogger that would have been the end. She helped me get it back up straight. I opted to quit and took it home.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  7. Feb 24, 2019 #47

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    Building a trailer system does not have much to do with building the plane ,or does it?

    One starts out with the concept. Then must figure out how you are to keep and use the plane. Where and how, become part of the plan. I had plenty of desire and ability but never enough money. If my resolves look a bit desperate. Well , if there is a will there is a way.

    The trailer was working but I had to protect against the plane ever falling over during launch. The cart was still primary launch, load and Garage vehicle. trailer and wheel mod 003.jpg I added to the wheel a roller .On the trailer I added the rail to capture the roller. Note the gas strut is extended here. on the trailer it suppose to be collapsed .

    This heavy lift gate had to go . In the spring of 2013 the lift began failing to pick the weight gain. By changing the lift to cradle and carriage system.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  8. Feb 24, 2019 #48

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    This cart and trailer is still in use . Now it is a direct launch from the trailer. The cart is now only used to go into the garage and is transferred to the trailer onto a carriage cradle . Using the cart the cradle straddles the cart and the plane is strapped and lifted off the cart. At the lake the carriage is lowered and backed into the lake for direct launch. I ready, pre flight the plane and run up before launch.
     
  9. Feb 25, 2019 #49

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    A short video on the trailers hydraulic plane lift. the cart is still under in the video. The plane would be strapped of and the wing turned when up then pushed forward off the lift to the front of the trailer. and secured with more straps for the road.
     
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  10. Feb 27, 2019 #50

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    This still photo as in the above video. 127_0252.jpg This photo you can see ,the tails support wire as described. And much more of the smaller build details the rear floats also have support wire.
    The elevator is a push pull tube with bell crank. The tail assemble has a tie rod through from one side to the other. The cables tang's have bearings to allow free movement under tension. A previous post shows a close up of the inner assembly. This is made up of a bearing plates and a short hallow shaft with a through horn.This makes up the center bearing. There is another short shaft unseen, that attaches to each half's leading edge with the horn. This also being the last flying configuration. I had moved the key and gauges to forward hang cage and seat supports. The key is in the lower left side of the seat frame . The gauges and the throttle in the red box.
     
  11. Feb 27, 2019 #51

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    Things you can not see. When creating a hole for cables ,in tube or flattened stock. I always put a S/S wear sleeve or liner in the hole. For a tube, I would also flatten the tube with a 1/8 thick flat stock sandwiched between the tube walls . Then drilled and lined the hole with S/S sleeve made from a thin walled S/S tubing . I would cut a short piece of tube about 1/8 longer than the flattened tube is thick and use a ball bearing to flare each side and lock in place. A good de burring of the hole would make room for the flare. No worries about wearing the hole out with this.
     
  12. Mar 6, 2019 #52

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    [video=youtube_share;YT6LQ0HU68M]https://youtu.be/YT6LQ0HU68M[/video]
    This system for vacuum forming is the same as one can buy from Aircraft Spruce and other sources. I just did not buy theirs. I was not sure the little venturi device was going to pull such a vacuum. So I stepped it up a little. I added some plumbing to my compressor. I have a gate valve. this allows me to directly pull from the compressors intake at a higher volume . This shortens the time it takes to get down to business. This direct method must be switched off to prevent the compressor over heating from a shortage of air.
    Then the air pressure through the venturi will do the job by itself better than one can imagine, as long as there is no leaks in the bagging.
    In the video one can see this little red block at the gauges that's what creates the real vacuum.
    I tried a few crazy things before I bought them .The compressors always got too hot . I had to buy a minimum purchase so I bought 2 and still was only $54. Mine did not come with a muffler or the hose barb.
    I pulled the vacuum on a sheet of birch 3/4 birch plywood.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2019
  13. Mar 6, 2019 #53

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    This vacuum bagging works so well . One must take care not to crush the polystyrene. Gauges and control of the supply pressure, will help to tune the operation.
    The low density polystyrene used for the new hull was crushed easy by this system. Other products like the very stretchy , green film was a must for my shapes.
    The hull was vacuum pulled in three stages . View attachment 78868 127_0232.jpg 127_0241.jpg

    The video shows the first pull this creates the socket that attaches to the boom. Next was the cockpit area, last was the bottom.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2019
  14. Mar 26, 2019 #54

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    I see the video posted for the vacuum does not work. And I can no longer edit that thread.
    I was describing the system I was using . And the tiny little venturi that does such a big job.
     
  15. May 7, 2019 #55

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    I have shown you what lead to the planes more successful conclusions. Here is one that was a big waste of time.
    Looking for more aft flotation I made this attempt.
    Using combination of foam . Low High polystyrene and urethane foam skin.
    covered with glass and kevlar. rear float wing 006.jpg rear float wing 019.jpg float changes 004.jpg
     
  16. May 7, 2019 #56

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    It did not work. Still it was a very tough structure I had a real difficult time destroying it for the trash. Using expanding foam as the adhesive, I also took a wire brush and hit making pin holes or brushing to roughen the surfaces to be glued enhancing the mechanical bond.
    I was disappointed in the urethane panels though more flexible they were much less supportive diaphragm. Also require the foil and plastic skin removed to use it
    the same board in polystyrene would be a better choice for any other project.
     
  17. May 7, 2019 #57

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    Here is another bad Idea. While planning to use the airfoil float. I cut back the lead on the under water float. The water test with this float system was impossible to achieve on step. float mod  004 (3).jpg
     
  18. May 7, 2019 #58

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    The first rear float system ,before flight and when it had the V tail.
    I made an arch airfoil shape this was a 2 piece . a leading edge half cut length wise with a continuous S wrap .
    At this point I have no experience with layups. doing it all wet and forming the arch it was flawed heat melt voids and with wrinkles on the underside these led to failure . 1st flt support  041.jpg 1st flt pod 040.jpg The Finished Airplane 004.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2019
  19. May 7, 2019 #59

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    These rear floats are needed to support the plane without a pilot. I had many comments sent my way about using this avenue .
    The intent was to also give some lateral stability.
    This setup did poorly , with the other flying effects the sponsons as I called them would dip and drag splashing the prop caused a lot of control problems.
    I turned them around the pointed end forward.
    This changed things , It now did less dipping and went up on plane and wanted to fly. But control was still a big problem and I blamed the V tail .
    Winter came and I built the new tail.
     
  20. May 7, 2019 #60

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

    Norm Langlois

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    At some point the arch gave way and the wedge floats system was created. That problem of insufficient flotations was not resolved, until after I began flying. I have no picture of that but I used one of those round floats ,cut it to fit the boom back under the tail. It worked that way untill I added a 2 inch layer on top the wedge floats. 127_0091.JPG
     
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