# X-Plane!

Discussion in 'Hangar Flying' started by ebonheart_2, Jan 30, 2006.

### Help Support HomeBuiltAirplanes Forum by donating:

1. Jan 30, 2006

### ebonheart_2

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Sep 22, 2005
Messages:
338
3
Location:
Delaware, USA
2. Jan 30, 2006

### orion

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Mar 3, 2003
Messages:
5,800
135
Location:
Western Washington
X-Plane has been discussed herein in several threads - if you use the search function I'm sure most of the stuff will come up. In short though, despite the significant and credible amount of work that has been done in developing the software, from an aircraft design and analysis standpoint, the software should really not be considered as anything other than a very advanced video game. Although the geometric components (Plane Maker) with which one models the aircraft allow you to achieve virtually any particualr shape, they and the subsequent analysis are incapable of modeling and simulating to a high enough degree of confidence for the flight sim to be used as anything other than maybe a first order model of the aircraft you're after. Last I checked, the analysis does not output any useful information, no numerical values and as such, a designer has no way of doing and/or optimizing the detailed type of modeling/analysis that is needed to verify performance and stability criteria.

However don't get me wrong - the developers have done an amazing amount of work in being able to deliver a cost effective tool for first cut modeling and yes, flight simulation. As far as the FAA stuff is concerned, if and only if the physical data that is input into the program is verified and correlated to a real world aircraft and its behavior, then there is no reason why the resultant flight charcteristics could not be used in simulating flight characteristics for the purpose of building time and for flight training and preliminary flight familiarization. But as the notice indicates, the FAA criteria is applicable only when used with a particular full motion simulator.

But again, keep in mind that this only applies when there is a real aircraft from which data can be derived and backed out, which can be used to tweak X-Plane's modeling of the characteristics to match the real world. For a new airplane design, there just insn't enough detail within the analysis module to catch all the nuances of flight. But, if the software was combined with standard design practices within an airframe development program, it could be viewed as a supplementary tool.

On the other hand, if someone was after just basic first-cut characteristics in checking out their own design, without getting into all the detail of an actual design program, X-Plane could tell you rather quickly whether your idea would get off the ground or not. In my opinion, it just should not be used as the only design/analysis tool in a development cycle.

Last edited: Jan 30, 2006
3. Jan 31, 2006

### ebonheart_2

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Sep 22, 2005
Messages:
338
3
Location:
Delaware, USA
Sorry I didnt look through the other threads before I posted. Actually... I was just wondering if it was a better simulator than FS 2004. I thought the plane maker thingy was nice, but I hadnt thought of using it to help design a plane, but I didnt state that.

4. Feb 1, 2006

### Chairboy

#### Member

Joined:
Jan 11, 2006
Messages:
14
0
Location:
Springfield, OR
It is certainly far more realistic than FS2004, as the latter relies on elaborate lookup tables which begin to rapidly lose touch with reality when you leave the 3 or 4 core airplane models that ship with the product.

5. Feb 2, 2006

### Spinnetti

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Dec 24, 2005
Messages:
93
1
Location:
Dallas TX, USA
If you want a good sim, try IL2 (from Ubisoft). It since morphed into Forgotten battles then Pacific fighters. I think its the best sim out there, but only if you like WWII warbirds!

6. Feb 4, 2006

### ebonheart_2

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Sep 22, 2005
Messages:
338
3
Location:
Delaware, USA
They all have their problems ofcoarse... I have Pacific Fighters and would like to have the IL-2 and Forgotten Battles, etc... Pacific Fighters is certainly better than CFS 3. :gig:

7. Feb 4, 2006

### StRaNgEdAyS

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Oct 20, 2003
Messages:
816
3
Location:
Northern NSW Australia
I actually just got an excellent deal for the new X-plane from e-bay $30 inc postage! When it comes to combat sims, I'm still stuck on AHII. Must be something about the crazy mixed up Bishops I like, they sure do not have any sense of organisation...lol BTW We flew il2's in Squad ops today, had some fun there. 8. Feb 7, 2006 ### ebonheart_2 ### ebonheart_2 #### Well-Known Member Joined: Sep 22, 2005 Messages: 338 Likes Received: 3 Location: Delaware, USA I guess this thread is about games isnt it. I think AH2 is interesting, but I would rather play FA online because it's faster for me, and there seems to alwase be better team work with the FA members. Has your X-Plane come in yet Strangedays? I'm wondering what it's like. I'm going to haved to say that Pacific Fighters is the most realistic combat flight sim I've ever played... IL-2 is sapposed to be just like it now isnt it? I havnt been able to find any good flight sims for modern air combat.. I've heard Lock-On is good.... the last combat jet sim I tryed was.... I forgot what it was called; it was terrible, and I alwase got frustrated with it... kinda like when playing CFS3. 9. Feb 7, 2006 ### Spinnetti ### Spinnetti #### Well-Known Member Joined: Dec 24, 2005 Messages: 93 Likes Received: 1 Location: Dallas TX, USA Haven't tried xplane. On the IL2 front, the first one was IL2, then Forgotten Battles, and then Ace expansion pack, then Pacific fighters. They are all the same sim, just more theatres and planes. Each update they tweak it more to make it as realistic as possible. I have all of it (its one big install) and love it - it will bring the fastest system you can buy to its knees at full settings though. Haven't seen a good jet sim, but I like WWII best anyway. I also like WWI stuff, but no good sims there yet. Last edited: Feb 7, 2006 10. Feb 8, 2006 ### Project AKOM ### Project AKOM #### Active Member Joined: Nov 6, 2005 Messages: 31 Likes Received: 0 Location: Eastbourne England since computers are my job i couldnt help but get invoved spinnetti although the il2 pack may bring regular "fast" pc's to there knees it wont bring them all let me introduce the BL04 (http://www.bluelightningcomputers.com/bl04.htm this is the fastest computer you can buy without designing it yourself (mines faster) and i can tell ya that your il2 pack wont bring this to its knees as for X-Plane that game rules oh and spinnitti have you played the "red barron" WW1 flight sim i used to spend hours at that game and i belive its the best WW1 sim out there only problem is it needs an older pc to run (pre-wondows XP) well just my$0.02 on the subject. have fun and keep simming

Last edited: Mar 3, 2006
11. Feb 9, 2006

### ebonheart_2

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Sep 22, 2005
Messages:
338
3
Location:
Delaware, USA
Well... except a university in Michagan has made a Quontium Processor.

(I cant spell)

12. Feb 9, 2006

### Project AKOM

#### Active Member

Joined:
Nov 6, 2005
Messages:
31
0
Location:
Eastbourne England
although the quantum processor could be faster than the athlon 64 4000 that is in my pc it is still in testing phases and doesnt apper that they will be released comercally in a "store bought" pc so the BL04 is technicly the fastest pc avalible that is a very good point that you made about my pc though it is not the fastest pc you can get but you would have to make a "homebuilt computer" to get a faster one

and i dont offer them in plan form you have to buy a kit:

Last edited: Feb 9, 2006
13. Feb 15, 2006

### ebonheart_2

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Sep 22, 2005
Messages:
338
3
Location:
Delaware, USA
I assembled my computer at home; it's stayed ahead of the game for 6 years... I'm just now having to update stuff. When you turn it on though, it kinda sounds like a microwave or something.. I'm going to haved to put a muffler of some sort on it.

14. Feb 15, 2006

### Project AKOM

#### Active Member

Joined:
Nov 6, 2005
Messages:
31
0
Location:
Eastbourne England
well james thats definatly what i mean by a homebuilt computer

it sounds like your system wants watercooling to keep it quiet which also has the advantage of being more efficiant than fans but can be quite expencive.

although all my prices are in pound sterling when the new website is up id be happy to ship parts to america (well not me coz iv just joint the airforce, but someone from my staff will)

15. Feb 15, 2006

### orion

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Mar 3, 2003
Messages:
5,800
135
Location:
Western Washington
My company is also after fast computers, although in our case we need the power for our work. I've done quite a bit of digging in my search for the best bang for the buck and found that one of the continually fastest PC based workstations is available from XiComputers (http://www.xicomputer.com/). Their tested benchmarks are always the highest, as is their products' stability and reliability.

I actually built my last workstation but the next one will most likely come from Xi. Yes, the prices can climb quite high but when you're after performance that does not become obsolete after two months, you do need to spend a bit more. You also need to get away from the retail types of components. This is especially true in our case where I'm looking for good video performance (CAD rendering and animation). The NVIDIA board I selected alone is about \$1,500 so the whole system is going to be more than an off the shelf system, but then it should deliver some pretty good performance for the next few years.

16. Feb 15, 2006

### Project AKOM

#### Active Member

Joined:
Nov 6, 2005
Messages:
31
0
Location:
Eastbourne England
well orion if ya want i can send u a pricelist (if theres anything i dont have i cvan get a price for you) and then you can see if it would be cheaper to go Blue Lightning

17. Feb 16, 2006

### Spinnetti

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Dec 24, 2005
Messages:
93
1
Location:
Dallas TX, USA
Geeze.. is this a freaking airplane forum or a computer sales forum? How about now back to our regularly scheduled daydreams....

18. Feb 16, 2006

### ebonheart_2

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Sep 22, 2005
Messages:
338
3
Location:
Delaware, USA
Except this thread is about a PC simulator.... so I imagion games and computers could make their way into the posts too.

19. Feb 19, 2006

### StRaNgEdAyS

#### Well-Known Member

Joined:
Oct 20, 2003
Messages:
816
3
Location:
Northern NSW Australia
Well I've played with x-plane a bit, and I do like it.
As you may have guessed, I've already modelled my future plane in it already (is that airfoil maker is a PITA or what?) and it flies! :ban:
The only problem I'm having is getting airspeed, I've got the engine dialed in at 200hp, and using a 3rd party prop design tool at make a hopefully aerodynamically accurate model of an MT prop (the propeller properties section leaves a lot to be desired) I can still only seem to get 80 KIAS max out of it, though I've been able to climb high enough to get 180KIAS in a dive:gig:.
I'll keep working on it, but I guess I'm just happy that the **** thing got off the ground and did actually fly.

20. Feb 19, 2006

Joined:
Dec 26, 2003
Messages:
270