WWII replica plans available in 2021?

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vhhjr

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I spent some time looking over the Ryan STA at Oshkosh and was impressed. It's unfortunate that D Motor dropped out of the US market it would have sounded much better than the high rpm Rotax. Perhaps the AeroMomentum engine will be a fit for them. The design really needs an inline four like the original Menesco. How about the newly certified Continental I4 diesel? Pricey I suspect, but if it isn't too heavy might work.

Vince Homer
 

vhhjr

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Had the same idea for the P-39 a few years back. Called Jerry Bates after several long discussions with members of the Replica Fighters Association. Jerry sent me his 1/4 scale plans and said try it. Now that I have a workshop again, I started to play at Model Scale (MS=50% of the Original). My MS scale has not been adjusted for the 100% pilot yet. Tonight I am working on a new Spar configuration. After I get the new spar figured out, I will reshape for the pilot and build the fuse at MS one last time. If there are no more changes, I'll increase to Final Scale and start cutting parts. I have two electric motors in mind...
View attachment 114125par configuration
I found 70% worked well for the P-39 mock-up I built several years ago using RC plans as a starting point. The mock-up was recently finished and is now part of a display in the EAA Chapter 292 facility.

Also included is a photo of a Jerry Bates 1/4 scale test bed with an attempted rear engine with driveshaft and front psru. Interesting exercise, but only semi-successful. Drive lines with single cylinder, two cycle engines aren't easy.
 

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flitzerpilot

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Hi Scott and PiperCruisin,

I know that the emphasis here has been on aluminium tube and riveted construction and that has been mooted for a Sperry M-1, but as the original was ash, spruce, plywood and fabric, that is the way I viewed the proposed replica. If another 3-cyilnder radial were to be available in due course I would not hesitate to complete my version (started last year): or if I continued with the prototype Goblin for an extant VW, retrofit a 3-cylinder radial for that subject.

The Sperry Messenger suspended in a US museum is a simplified replica with many structural changes which are obvious on close inspection. Pictures of this were forwarded to me last year and I was able identify those aspects. I understand that this machine was intended to fly originally, but as far as I know this aim was never achieved.
 

ScaleBirdsScott

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I concur that a Messenger, simple as it is, should be wooden construction as per original.

Shame the Verner 3V doesn't make 50-60hp regardless of current availability to order one.
 

PMD

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Apr 11, 2015
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Martensville SK
I spent some time looking over the Ryan STA at Oshkosh and was impressed. It's unfortunate that D Motor dropped out of the US market it would have sounded much better than the high rpm Rotax. Perhaps the AeroMomentum engine will be a fit for them. The design really needs an inline four like the original Menesco. How about the newly certified Continental I4 diesel? Pricey I suspect, but if it isn't too heavy might work.

Vince Homer
If I was free to do so, I would import and sell these all day long:

Have a good friend who built a fantastic float plane with the 6 cylinder - complete with beta thrust. Extremely well proven and cost effective. There WAS a distributor in Thunder Bay ON as I have been told - IIRC no longer alive and his successors not interested in the business.
 

Tiger Tim

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Can you fill us in on the former LOM PRAHA distributor who lived in T-Bay????
Sort of. I never met him but I know his son through work. I was in charge of a charter/medevac company and he’s an aviation inspector at our local Transport Canada office. I suspect his job interferes with any possibility of continuing his father’s business.
 

Saville

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Having known all the principles and players in Fighter Escort Wing for more than 30 years and having been around their prototype up through flying, I can attest to the absolute quality and fastidious attention to detail as well as very good quality control with the composite parts (my career at Boeing was composite materials/process development).
Somebody needs to rescue that FEW mustang...
I did some web searching on the FEW P-51 after reading post #39. Plane looks good. Don't know how it handles or performs.
 

PiperCruisin

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Idaho
Hi Scott and PiperCruisin,

I know that the emphasis here has been on aluminium tube and riveted construction and that has been mooted for a Sperry M-1, but as the original was ash, spruce, plywood and fabric, that is the way I viewed the proposed replica. If another 3-cyilnder radial were to be available in due course I would not hesitate to complete my version (started last year): or if I continued with the prototype Goblin for an extant VW, retrofit a 3-cylinder radial for that subject.

The Sperry Messenger suspended in a US museum is a simplified replica with many structural changes which are obvious on close inspection. Pictures of this were forwarded to me last year and I was able identify those aspects. I understand that this machine was intended to fly originally, but as far as I know this aim was never achieved.
I agree with Scott, building one with the similar techniques/wood seems appropriate. If the engine available does not have similar power, then maybe it needs to be scaled down a bit and/or the construction modernized a bit to reduce weight.

I think the one at the Smithsonian is real and not a reproduction. Their website says, however, that it was a "Sport"/2-place and was converted back to the military configuration as it would have been in WWI.
 

David L. Downey

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Harleysville, PA
I did some web searching on the FEW P-51 after reading post #39. Plane looks good. Don't know how it handles or performs.
I spoke in person with at least 4 pilots who spent time in the prototype. they all praised it for its behavior. Of course, suitable power was the struggle all along.
 

Twister51

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Jun 5, 2010
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Enid, OK
Having known all the principles and players in Fighter Escort Wing for more than 30 years and having been around their prototype up through flying, I can attest to the absolute quality and fastidious attention to detail as well as very good quality control with the composite parts (my career at Boeing was composite materials/process development).
Somebody needs to rescue that FEW mustang...

What were FEW's problems as a company? Why did they fail? Not poking a stick in their eye, many great designs have failed as a business. Was it solely the lack of a reliable engine? I saw one YT video of a FEW that flew after many years of work and it soon crashed. Heart-breaking.
 

flitzerpilot

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PiperCruisin,

Yes the Smithsonian example is original, reconverted to single-seat/aerial 'hook-on' parasite configuration for the Museum.

The one suspended in the (Cradle of Flight?) museum is a replica and differs structurally from the original in several aspects.

The basic Flitzer Z-21/21 is close conceptually to the M-1. The replica I started spans 18', like the Flitzer, but has more wing area due to the increased chords, at 39". I decided on the deeper USA 27 airfoil which was tested on an actual M-1, to take advantage of its depth for structural reasons while maintaining authenticity. The M-1 pilot is situated much further forward than in the Z-1, which is advantageous for light engines and the mobile CP of the USA 27, like that of the USA 35B of the Z-1, provides for good X-country stability combined with excellent manoeuvrability in pitch..
 

nicknack

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Jul 27, 2008
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66
what about this one. Says the basic configuration uses a rotax915is and faster variant may use an LS engine?
 

ScaleBirdsScott

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Uncasville, CT
ScaleWings, like ScaleBirds and Titan and others are basically all kit-only. Good data points to have tho. Being new, and European, and carbon, it's definitely expensive and it isn't first to come to mind for many here. But they do make a very nice looking machine for absolute surety.

For my part with ScaleBirds I don't anticipate ever offering the designs as plans in part because I've basically made up my mind to design as much as possible around CNC made parts vs hand-made parts where it can provide some substantial benefits. But we have debated doing a 'stripped down' base kit that provides a potential customer with a core fuse frame and a wing and tail kits and all the CNC parts and weldments needed; with a few base options of starting point for landing gear and so-on. And then we'd pair that with a set of plans and patterns for taking that stripped base to the as-designed final form of one of our established designs, say the P40. So like a half-plans/half-kit approach.

Now, whether the builder follows those plans, or goes off on their own direction from that point, well that is between them and their DAR I guess.
 
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