# Workshop lighting

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#### BJC

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Not wanting to hijack the thread on lighting an off-grid hangar, I started this thread.

HBA Supporter

#### cvairwerks

I'm putting T5HO 4 lamp fixtures with 54W 6500K bulbs in my shop. The 6500K really helps when trying to color match something. The only bummer about them is the lamp cost...23$per bulb. #### Vigilant1 ##### Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter ? . . he's really big on replacing his fluorescent shop light bulbs with the LED variety. He maintains you get more light with the same, or less, power. It would be true if LEDs were more efficient than fluorescents, but they are not. Just do the math on the commonly available lamps: T8 fluorescent takes 32 watts to give about 2950 lumens = 92 lumens per watt. A typical 10 watt LED screw-in replacement for an incandescent bulb gives about 900 lumens = 90 lumens per watt. There are other reasons people might prefer LEDs, but initial cost and overall energy efficiency for broad area lighting are not among them? On the LED lamps, if they have the term "effective lumens"' then know it is pure snake oil. #### rv6ejguy ##### Well-Known Member I always run a cost analysis first. We pay around 7-8 cents/ kilowatt hr. here for electricity. Look at Lumens per watt per dollar and how many hours a day you have your lights on per year. Look at the payback time for one bulb. At this point LEDs don't make sense if you want to save money. My CFLs have years more life left, by then maybe LEDs will have come down to the same prices. They're just hosing people right now because they are new and are shaming people into getting rid of perfectly good CFLs, claiming better efficiency. LEDs are dirt cheap in China and should be here too. I'm waiting for that. #### Kyle Boatright ##### Well-Known Member HBA Supporter There are other reasons people might prefer LEDs, but initial cost and overall energy efficiency for broad area lighting are not among them? I spent$40/fixture plus $27 for bulbs (net, almost$70/fixture) for T8 lights and fixtures that are equivalent to the $35 LED's I purchased for my garage. Beyond that, those$9 T8 bulbs have a fairly sharp drop off in lumens over their 10k hour life. LED's don't. If you live long enough, you're likely to replace the T8's 5 times before the LED's die (not that many of us will need to replace the T8 bulbs). Also, the LED's don't have the low temperature issues fluorescents do (not that I'll be in a 0F workshop).

IMO, the *right* LED's are a pretty good deal that I've been unable to match in fluorescent lights.

#### Vigilant1

I spent $40/fixture plus$27 for bulbs (net, almost $70/fixture) for T8 lights and fixtures I'm sure it is possible to spend that much, but I see shop lights ( good quality electronic ballasts, etc) advertised all the time for$10. The T8 bulbs for them are another $1.50 (I don't know how it is possible to spend$13.50 per bulb!) so that is $13.00 total cost per fixture that draws about 68 watts and produces 5900 lumens. I would like to see a comparable LED fixture that matches that price for similar output. And the electric efficiency is almost identical. Note that I am being very conservative on the lumens for the T8s-- some 32 watt bulbs put out 3300 lumens initially, with a mean output over their life of 3100 lumens each. And there are many color temps available. I don't hate LEDs, like I said, there are good reasons to choose them for many applications if you need a well-focused output, if you need something shock resistant, if you like the light quality. But for general background lighting of a hangar, especially one that won't be used all day every day, I don't see a strong case for them right now when compared to fluorescent bulbs (unless a person just has extra money or wants to have the newest thing). Last edited: #### Pops ##### Well-Known Member HBA Supporter Log Member I think that CFL are about at the bottom of my list for lighting. Nothing about them that I like. Dan #### rv6ejguy ##### Well-Known Member I've got T12s in my new hangar with electronic ballasts, instant full bright light, no flicker even when cold. I keep it around 10C (50F). Work fine and and not expensive. #### VFR-on-top ##### Well-Known Member I began replacing florescents in my shop with LEDs when the transformers from my Home Depot fixtures began failing. Agree with the comments re: buying online. It's the only way to go for equipping a large shop. But before you buy in bulk, test a few in your shop. Also note that they're likely from China. Some may be defective as reported in reviews, but Amazon makes it easy to replace. One of mine was missing hardware and they sent me another one quickly. I've also replaced all my out sodium and halide fixtures outside the shop and around the house with these as well. The outside screw-in bulb fixtures on the house got LED bulbs on sale from Home Depot. This one is available for around$20. A huge price drop from only a year ago. This is not the one I bought though, I believe mine were 30 watts.

http://www.amazon.com/LEDMart-Landscape-Outdoor-Waterproof-90-240v/dp/B00NC2ZW56/ref=sr_1_2?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1451031230&sr=1-2&keywords=outdoor+led

Quote: "I also appreciate the distributed area of emission that you get with a long fluorescent tube."

Agree.

#### gtae07

##### Well-Known Member
I fitted out my shop with 9 T8 twin-bulb fixtures and put in 6500K fluorescent tubes. With white semigloss walls it's nice and bright inside. Seeing as I'd probably wind up moving before the tubes needed to be replaced and I couldn't get LEDs in the color I wanted, I just stuck with fluorescent.

I've also been replacing all the bulbs in the house with 5000K LED bulbs. It's so much nicer inside, nice and brightly lit and not dingy yellow.

#### Joe Fisher

##### Well-Known Member
I am kind of interested in the LED's I had 15 fluorescent shop lights. I have been replacing them with the 40wat screw in type. I listen to AM radio for long hours I have a car radio with a power supply and an out side antenna. Because the fluorescent lights interfere with the radio if they are working good. Two or more times a week a light will go bad still light but makes a racket in the radio. So I climb up and trade bulbs around and fine the offender and replace it. I wounder what other draw back the LED lights might have.

#### Kyle Boatright

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
I'm sure it is possible to spend that much, but I see shop lights ( good quality electronic ballasts, etc) advertised all the time for $10. The T8 bulbs for them are another$1.50 (I don't know how it is possible to spend $13.50 per bulb!) so that is$13.00 total cost per fixture that draws about 68 watts and produces 5900 lumens. I would like to see a comparable LED fixture that matches that price for similar output. And the electric efficiency is almost identical. Note that I am being very conservative on the lumens for the T8s-- some 32 watt bulbs put out 3300 lumens initially, with a mean output over their life of 3100 lumens each. And there are many color temps available.
Can you provide a link to those $10 fixtures and$1.50 bulbs? BTW, the T8 fixtures I used have 3 bulbs. So I'm using \$9 bulbs, which are available at the local big box stores.