Why battery-powered aircraft will never have significant range

[WINGITIS]

We don't have part 103 here. If it flys it needs either a Microlight cert or a PPL, and to be registered as either Microlight or GA.

Yes we need a certifcate from the club, but that is it, a NEWBIE with his own design Class 1 can fly without training etc, or even a radio, just a basic aircraft safety check by the club.

A Class 1 did not need to be registered, does it now?

I have just read our PART-103 consolidation doc and the AC103-1 from CAANZ and nothing seems to have changed unless there is a registration requirement for Class 1's that I have not found?

There is a part about applying for an exception for custom numbers if you want a warbird type paint job with PERIOD numbers...but that is an addition not a basic requirement.

The CAANZ website is poorly implemented though, so there may be something in there somewhere!?

There is no log book or maintenace log or schedule required either for a Class 1 and the Bi-annual club check is OPTIONAL.

The medical is A SELF DECLARATION(attached)

The whole idea was to make it as FREE as possible!

 

[Kiwi303]

A Class 1 needs to be registered. Class 1 mirolights are single seater, Class 2 are two seater, Anything with more than 2 seats must be registered GA, not Microlight.

The American Part 103 is for light aricraft less than 240pounds or so with 5 gallons or less of fuel which can be flown without aircraft registration, training or licences.

The NZ part 103 is for Microlight aircraft which must be registered, the pilot must hold a Microlight Pilots Certificate issued by an affiliated Part 149 organisation, and must stall at 45knt or less at maximum weight for it's class.

To get a Microlight pilot certificate requires flight training:

https://raanz.org.nz/wiki/uploads/Main/structurechart.pdf

I think the SAC has the best laid out set of the requirements

https://www.sportflying.co.nz/uploads/8/8/2/4/8824800/sac_expo_section_5.0_rev.0.pdf

 

[WINGITIS]

A Class 1 needs to be registered. Class 1 mirolights are single seater, Class 2 are two seater, Anything with more than 2 seats must be registered GA, not Microlight.

The American Part 103 is for light aricraft less than 240pounds or so with 5 gallons or less of fuel which can be flown without aircraft registration, training or licences.

The NZ part 103 is for Microlight aircraft which must be registered, the pilot must hold a Microlight Pilots Certificate issued by an affiliated Part 149 organisation, and must stall at 45knt or less at maximum weight for it's class.

To get a Microlight pilot certificate requires flight training:

https://raanz.org.nz/wiki/uploads/Main/structurechart.pdf

I think the SAC has the best laid out set of the requirements

https://www.sportflying.co.nz/uploads/8/8/2/4/8824800/sac_expo_section_5.0_rev.0.pdf

Yes I know the weight limits and stall, that is what I have been designing to, for which I have had to DESIGN BETTER AIRFOILS!

The RAANZ document, in your first link, confirms a novice certificate requires NO EXPERIENCE..and their self declaration health form.

An instructor does have to approve cross country flights.

The second link also confirms what I have noted in the other aspects, BUT there is no reference to registering a Microlight?

Some may assume it, but it has to be stated...

I would be keen to know if it is documented somewhere, because it is important!

Some of the SAC rules are stated as facts but are different to what the CCANZ states....?

 

[Kiwi303]

If you look, Novice, then First Solo, then Intermediate which then allows solo flights.

So you can't fly a single seater Class 1 microlight on a Novice certificate.

You need to solo and obtain your Intermediate BEFORE you can fly that Class 1.


103.5 Pilot requirements
(a) Each person acting as the pilot of a microlight aircraft shall—
(1) hold an appropriate current microlight pilot certificate with an
appropriate type rating; or
(2) hold a current pilot licence issued under Part 61 with an
appropriate type rating; or
(3) operate under the direct supervision of the holder of a microlight
pilot instructor certificate meeting the requirements of 103.7


To fly a Class 1 single seater you need under 103.5 (a)(1) to be able to fly solo which requires an appropriate current Intermediate or above certificate. You can only fly as a Novice certificate holder under 103.5(a)(3) with direct supervison in a Class 2 two seater aircraft.

 

[alvinator]

I think you are losing the north and overestimating or you have seen too much science fiction. In 50 years most of the technology, lifestyle and welfare will be the same as now similar to the technological leap from 1980 to 2020, mostly in the good countries that invest in technology development and high quality industries. And I'm sure we can cut all the forests with great machinery and the temperature outside my window and the tide in the beach will be the same.

You have a little bit of a problem with math... 1970 to 2020 would be 50 years... and if you think we are using the same technology as 1970????? 1970 didn't have home computers, fuel injection, variable valve timing.... cell phones, computers, fuel cells, electric engines, battery technology, plastic... how about just some things that are obsolete since 1970, pictures, watches, phones, carburetors, tube tires, tv antennas, leaded gas,

 

[WINGITIS]

If you look, Novice, then First Solo, then Intermediate which then allows solo flights.

So you can't fly a single seater Class 1 microlight on a Novice certificate.

You need to solo and obtain your Intermediate BEFORE you can fly that Class 1.


103.5 Pilot requirements
(a) Each person acting as the pilot of a microlight aircraft shall—
(1) hold an appropriate current microlight pilot certificate with an
appropriate type rating; or
(2) hold a current pilot licence issued under Part 61 with an
appropriate type rating; or
(3) operate under the direct supervision of the holder of a microlight
pilot instructor certificate meeting the requirements of 103.7


To fly a Class 1 single seater you need under 103.5 (a)(1) to be able to fly solo which requires an appropriate current Intermediate or above certificate. You can only fly as a Novice certificate holder under 103.5(a)(3) with direct supervison in a Class 2 two seater aircraft.

I do not see SOLO in that chart on the first line!?

Its on the second as a step for the instructor to sign off on, but you could have done that on the farm ages ago!?

The SAC document even confirms my interpretation there..

2. Cross-Country Flights
2.1 Every cross-country flight in a Microlight Aircraft conducted by the holder of a Novice Pilot Certificate or equivalent shall be authorised by an instructor.

 

[WINGITIS]

The PART-103 does say you can apply to register a Microlight but does not say you have to.

103.101 Registration
(a) Each applicant for the grant of a certificate of registration under Part
47 for a microlight aircraft shall provide the Director with evidence that the
aircraft meets—
(1) basic low performance and momentum parameters that are
acceptable to the Director for a microlight aircraft; or
(2) a type design standard listed in 103.207(a)(1)(ii).

 

[Kiwi303]

Registration is under the Civil Aviation Act 1990.

Entry into the civil aviation system
6 Requirement to register aircraft
(1)
Except as otherwise provided in this Act or rules made under this Act, every person lawfully entitled to the possession of an aircraft for a period of 28 days or longer which flies to, from, within, or over New Zealand territory shall register that aircraft and hold a valid certificate of registration for that aircraft from—
(a)
the Director; or
(b)
the appropriate aeronautical authorities of a contracting State of ICAO; or
(c)
the appropriate aeronautical authorities of another State that is party to an agreement with the Government of New Zealand or the Civil Aviation Authority for New Zealand which provides for the acceptance of each other’s registrations.
(2)
No aircraft shall be registered in or remain registered in New Zealand if it is registered in any other country.


The director delegates Microlight registration to Part 149 organisations, SAC and RAANZ.






Also:

 

[Dana]

Or not so novel. See post #2,066. ;-)

Wow. Is there a medium sized army living in your house? Family of two using ours (sized for 4 bedrooms) since around 1995, and I'm thinking it's about time to get it pumped. It is a treatment plant, though (aerated aerobic system; not an anaerobic septic).

It's a simple septic tank and not quite as large as it should be, it has to be pumped periodically before the solids overflow the baffle and clog the leaching field.

 

[alvinator]

internal combustion technology is propably the best invention in the history of humanity,

WHAT???????? ARE YOU SMOKING???????

 

[WINGITIS]

Registration is under the Civil Aviation Act 1990.

Entry into the civil aviation system
6 Requirement to register aircraft
(1)
Except as otherwise provided in this Act or rules made under this Act, every person lawfully entitled to the possession of an aircraft for a period of 28 days or longer which flies to, from, within, or over New Zealand territory shall register that aircraft and hold a valid certificate of registration for that aircraft from—
(a)
the Director; or
(b)
the appropriate aeronautical authorities of a contracting State of ICAO; or
(c)
the appropriate aeronautical authorities of another State that is party to an agreement with the Government of New Zealand or the Civil Aviation Authority for New Zealand which provides for the acceptance of each other’s registrations.
(2)
No aircraft shall be registered in or remain registered in New Zealand if it is registered in any other country.


The director delegates Microlight registration to Part 149 organisations, SAC and RAANZ.






Also:

View attachment 115581

As above for the chart interpretation:

The SAC document even confirms my interpretation there..

2. Cross-Country Flights
2.1 Every cross-country flight in a Microlight Aircraft conducted by the holder of a Novice Pilot Certificate or equivalent shall be authorised by an instructor.

 

[Kiwi303]

Still needs to have passed Solo and been signed off as authorised to fly solo, which requires training, not jumping in to fly off with 0 experience, How many hours before they first get to go solo? Then how many hours before the instructor is comfortable with them disappearing alone into the wild blue yonder?

Your arguement to begin with was Class 1 needed 0 experience by a builder, just build it and hop in and fly it like a US Part 103 ultralight. Our NZ part 103 Microlight regulation doesn't work that way, we aren't the US of A.
You need 0 experience to get a novice cert, but you need training and experience to have an instructor be happy signing you off to go solo, you need that solo authorisation to fly your single seat Class 1 microlight.
Ergo you need experience to hop in your homebuilt Class 1 and fly off.

Also unlike America, the Civil Aviation Act and the associated CAA Part 47 rule requires all aircraft to be registered before it is permitted to fly, so again hopping in your newly completed homebuilt for a flight isn't that simple.




Also, finally found the Part 47 on the CAANZ website, re registration.

Part 47 Aircraft Registration and Marking | aviation.govt.nz

www.aviation.govt.nz

Under forms you see "Microlight, Class 1, Class 2" on the form, Registration of ALL aircraft, inclusive of Class 1 microlights, is a legaslative requirement.

https://www.aviation.govt.nz/assets/forms/24047_01.pdf

 

[WINGITIS]

Registration is under the Civil Aviation Act 1990.

Entry into the civil aviation system
6 Requirement to register aircraft
(1)
Except as otherwise provided in this Act or rules made under this Act, every person lawfully entitled to the possession of an aircraft for a period of 28 days or longer which flies to, from, within, or over New Zealand territory shall register that aircraft and hold a valid certificate of registration for that aircraft from—
(a)
the Director; or
(b)
the appropriate aeronautical authorities of a contracting State of ICAO; or
(c)
the appropriate aeronautical authorities of another State that is party to an agreement with the Government of New Zealand or the Civil Aviation Authority for New Zealand which provides for the acceptance of each other’s registrations.
(2)
No aircraft shall be registered in or remain registered in New Zealand if it is registered in any other country.


The director delegates Microlight registration to Part 149 organisations, SAC and RAANZ.






Also:

View attachment 115581

Ok, I have called CAANZ and asked them the two questions:

1: Does a Class 1 Microlight need registration, she stated YES but was not aware of what the history was.

It goes against their clause:

2) a type design standard listed in 103.207(a)(1)(ii)

Which only mentions Class 2's.

But at this stage SOLVED, thanks

2: Can a home designed Class 1 built by the owner be flown by him on a novice Certificate as the SAC document states, or does the novice need to get, two seater instruction first.

She though It could be fly by flown by a novice, but when I asked her to put it in writing she said she would check it with someone and E-mail me the result.

I will post it when I get it.

 

[WINGITIS]

Still needs to have passed Solo and been signed off as authorised to fly solo, which requires training, not jumping in to fly off with 0 experience, How many hours before they first get to go solo? Then how many hours before the instructor is comfortable with them disappearing alone into the wild blue yonder?

Your arguement to begin with was Class 1 needed 0 experience by a builder, just build it and hop in and fly it like a US Part 103 ultralight. Our NZ part 103 Microlight regulation doesn't work that way, we aren't the US of A.
You need 0 experience to get a novice cert, but you need training and experience to have an instructor be happy signing you off to go solo, you need that solo authorisation to fly your single seat Class 1 microlight.
Ergo you need experience to hop in your homebuilt Class 1 and fly off.

Also unlike America, the Civil Aviation Act and the associated CAA Part 47 rule requires all aircraft to be registered before it is permitted to fly, so again hopping in your newly completed homebuilt for a flight isn't that simple.




Also, finally found the Part 47 on the CAANZ website, re registration.

Part 47 Aircraft Registration and Marking | aviation.govt.nz

www.aviation.govt.nz

Under forms you see "Microlight, Class 1, Class 2" on the form, Registration of ALL aircraft, inclusive of Class 1 microlights, is a legaslative requirement.

https://www.aviation.govt.nz/assets/forms/24047_01.pdf

How do you think a hang glider pilot learns...

The RAANZ chart can be interpreted both ways!

The SAC document is clear....

2. Cross-Country Flights
2.1 Every cross-country flight in a Microlight Aircraft conducted by the holder of a Novice Pilot Certificate or equivalent shall be authorised by an instructor.

I will update you with what the CAA send me.


The registration issue also makes one wonder what a POWERED HANG GLIDER IS!?

Or a Powered parachute, I dont see registrations there....

What are they?

 

[Dan Thomas]

You have a little bit of a problem with math... 1970 to 2020 would be 50 years... and if you think we are using the same technology as 1970????? 1970 didn't have home computers, fuel injection, variable valve timing.... cell phones, computers, fuel cells, electric engines, battery technology, plastic... how about just some things that are obsolete since 1970, pictures, watches, phones, carburetors, tube tires, tv antennas, leaded gas,

I didn't know we didn't have electric motors in 1970. I wonder what was powering all my tools? Or what it was that was starting in all my cars and trucks and boats? Or all those factories with three-phase power? And brushless DC motors, also known as stepper motors? You know, the ones used in today's electric cars and airplanes? The British Royal Navy was using them in the 1930s for rotating the gun turrets on their ships.

Or the NiCad battery that was invented in 1899 but took nearly 100 years to show up in my cordless tools. Or the lithium ion battery developed in 1967 or so. Ballard has been building fuel cells since the early 1980s. Almost 40 years ago. Or the variable valve timing used not only in steam locomotives but in engines such as these:

Aircraft
An early experimental 200 hp Clerget V-8 from the 1910s used a sliding camshaft to change the valve timing[citation needed]. Some versions of the Bristol Jupiter radial engine of the early 1920s incorporated variable valve timing gear, mainly to vary the inlet valve timing in connection with higher compression ratios.[5] The Lycoming R-7755 [1944] engine had a Variable Valve Timing system consisting of two cams that can be selected by the pilot. One for take off, pursuit and escape, the other for economical cruising.

Or these:

Automotive
The desirability of being able to vary the valve opening duration to match an engine's rotational speed first became apparent in the 1920s when maximum allowable RPM limits were generally starting to rise. Until about this time an engine's idle RPM and its operating RPM were very similar, meaning that there was little need for variable valve duration. The first use of variable valve timing was on the 1903 Cadillac Runabout and Tonneau created by Alanson Partridge Brush Patent 767,794 “INLET VALVE GEAR FOR INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINES” filed August 3rd, 1903, and granted August 16th, 1904.[6] Some time prior to 1919 Lawrence Pomeroy, Vauxhall's Chief Designer, had designed a 4.4 L engine for a proposed replacement for the existing 30-98 model to be called the H-Type.[7] In this engine the single overhead camshaft was to move longitudinally to allow different camshaft lobes to be engaged. It was in the 1920s that the first patents for variable duration valve opening started appearing – for example United States patent U.S. Patent 1,527,456.

In 1958 Porsche made application for a German Patent, also applied for and published as British Patent GB861369 in 1959. The Porsche patent used an oscillating cam to increase the valve lift and duration. The desmodromic cam driven via a push/pull rod from an eccentric shaft or swashplate. It is unknown if any working prototype was ever made.

Fiat was the first auto manufacturer to patent a functional automotive variable valve timing system which included variable lift. Developed by Giovanni Torazza in the late 1960s, the system used hydraulic pressure to vary the fulcrum of the cam followers (US Patent 3,641,988).[8] The hydraulic pressure changed according to engine speed and intake pressure. The typical opening variation was 37%.

Alfa Romeo was the first manufacturer to use a variable valve timing system in production cars (US Patent 4,231,330).[9] The fuel injected models of the 1980 Alfa Romeo Spider 2000 had a mechanical VVT system. The system was engineered by Ing Giampaolo Garcea in the 1970s.[10] All Alfa Romeo Spider models from 1983 onward used electronic VVT.[11]

All that from a quick Wiki check.

Plastics? Just since 1970? Are you serious? Plexiglass was available in 1933 and was used in WW2 in aircraft. I have worked on 1960s Cessna full of ABS, PVC and other plastics. Cessna (and all the other airframe manufacturers) are still using all those in their new airplanes, and so are the car manufacturers. Cars used them in the '60s too. Plastic toys were displacing metal toys in the early 1960s. I was selling Lexan (polycarbonate) lenses in the early 1970s. My Jodel got its Lexan windshield and canopy in 1975.

Fuel injection, in mechanical form, was used in mid-1950s Chevys. I had aftermarket electronic CDI ignition in my '75 Ford Courier, and Chrysler used it before that. A little more from Wiki:

The first electronic ignition (a cold cathode type) was tested in 1948 by Delco-Remy,[5] while Lucas introduced a transistorized ignition in 1955, which was used on BRM and Coventry Climax Formula One engines in 1962.[5] The aftermarket began offering EI that year, with both the AutoLite Electric Transistor 201 and Tung-Sol EI-4 (thyratron capacitive discharge) being available.[6] Pontiac became the first automaker to offer an optional EI, the breakerless magnetic pulse-triggered Delcotronic, on some 1963 models; it was also available on some Corvettes.[6] The first commercially available all solid-state (SCR) capacitive discharge ignition was manufactured by Hyland Electronics in Canada also in 1963. Ford fitted a FORD designed breakerless system on the Lotus 25s entered at Indianapolis the next year, ran a fleet test in 1964, and began offering optional EI on some models in 1965. This electronic system was utilized on the GT40s campaigned by Shelby American and Holman and Moody. Robert C. Hogle, Ford Motor Company, presented the, "Mark II-GT Ignition and Electrical System", Publication #670068, at the SAE Congress, Detroit, Michigan, January 9-13, 1967. Beginning in 1958, Earl W. Meyer at Chrysler worked on EI, continuing until 1961 and resulting in use of EI on the company's NASCAR hemis in 1963 and 1964.[6]

Prest-O-Lite's CD-65, which relied on capacitance discharge (CD), appeared in 1965, and had "an unprecedented 50,000 mile warranty."[6] (This differs from the non-CD Prest-O-Lite system introduced on AMC products in 1972, and made standard equipment for the 1975 model year.)[6] A similar CD unit was available from Delco in 1966,[5] which was optional on Oldsmobile, Pontiac, and GMC vehicles in the 1967 model year.[6] Also in 1967, Motorola debuted their breakerless CD system.[6] The most famous aftermarket electronic ignition which debuted in 1965, was the Delta Mark 10 capacitive discharge ignition, which was sold assembled or as a kit.

The Fiat Dino was the first production car to come standard with EI in 1968, followed by the Jaguar XJ Series 1[7] in 1971, Chrysler (after a 1971 trial) in 1973 and by Ford and GM in 1975.[6]

In 1967, Prest-O-Lite made a "Black Box" ignition amplifier, intended to take the load off the distributor's breaker points during high rpm runs, which was used by Dodge and Plymouth on their factory Super Stock Coronet and Belvedere drag racers.[6] This amplifier was installed on the interior side of the cars' firewall, and had a duct which provided outside air to cool the unit.[citation needed] The rest of the system (distributor and spark plugs) remains as for the mechanical system. The lack of moving parts compared with the mechanical system leads to greater reliability and longer service intervals.

Chrysler introduced breakerless ignition in mid-1971 as an option for its 340 V8 and the 426 Street Hemi. For the 1972 model year, the system became standard on its high-performance engines (the 340 cu in (5.6 l) and the four-barrel carburetor-equipped 400 hp (298 kW) 400 cu in (7 l)) and was an option on its 318 cu in (5.2 l), 360 cu in (5.9 l), two-barrel 400 cu in (6.6 l), and low-performance 440 cu in (7.2 l). Breakerless ignition was standardised across the model range for 1973.

Carburetors are still being used on a gazillion small engines. Just try buying a lawnmower or chainsaw with EFI. Some aircraft are still being built with them.

History started long before you were born. There are a lot of things that have been around for a long time that we're still using. Books, for instance. Rubber. Wood, for Pete's sake. There are lots of things that just don't have any credible alternatives. Just because something is old technology does not mean that it's obsolete.

 

[Kiwi303]

How do you think a hang glider pilot learns...

Part 101, part 105 and part 106 are exempt from registration.

that's ballons/kites/parasails/gyrogliders (101), etc, Parachuting (105) and Hang-glider (106)

There are condition limitations, height etc, for 106 they can operate one under supervison. 106.5(b)

106.5 - Pilot requirements

(a) A pilot of a hang glider must—

(1) be a bona fide member of a hang gliding organisation; and

(2) hold an appropriate hang glider pilot certificate; and

(3) comply with the privileges and limitations of his or her pilot certificate and any applicable ratings; and

(4) comply with the operational standards and procedures of the hang gliding organisation.

(b) Despite paragraph (a)(2), a person who does not hold an appropriate hang glider pilot certificate may operate a hang glider under the direct supervision of the holder of a hang glider instructor certificate issued by a hang gliding organisation referred to in paragraph (a)(1).

 

[WINGITIS]

Part 101, part 105 and part 106 are exempt.

that's ballons/kites/parasails/gyrogliders (101), etc, Parachuting (105) and Hang-glider (106)

There are condition limitations, height etc, but not licencing/certification of the pilot limits.

I meant they learn without getting a co-pilots instructions....

 

[Aesquire]

History started long before you were born.

Even before I was born!

I meant they learn without getting a co-pilots instructions....

I learned the hard way, but tandem towed instruction is pretty common now. I'm actually a bit jealous. Getting a tow up to 2 k and getting tips on how to turn, set up for a landing, would have been nice.

 

[Kiwi303]

I meant they learn without getting a co-pilots instructions....

I've never paid much attention to hang-gliding etc, But I would suspect they have the equivalent of newbies ski slopes, nice shallow hillsides with not too much slope but placed where the prevailing breeze gives enough ridge lift to learn but where they can't really go so far up as to end up dead on losing lift unless they REALLY muck it up.

You don't take a newbie skiier and drop them from a helicopter at the top of the Remarkables, there're nice flattish bits close to the ski-lifts for that.

Wouldn't it make sense for hang-gliders to have their version of a beginners slope?

 

[WINGITIS]

Even before I was born!




I learned the hard way, but tandem towed instruction is pretty common now. I'm actually a bit jealous. Getting a tow up to 2 k and getting tips on how to turn, set up for a landing, would have been nice.

Oh yes I see, beats throwing oneself off a cliff!

Here is a hill near me, theres been a few deaths there...