What Kind of Country Have We Become...

Discussion in 'The light stuff area' started by rbrochey, Feb 6, 2018.

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  1. Feb 6, 2018 #1

    rbrochey

    rbrochey

    rbrochey

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    that we have this stupid 254 pound ultralight rule? It makes no sense to me... it seems to me that taking it to three hundred pound limit, excluding a power plant, would result in a much safer and doable design that would enable far more people to participate... Look at the EMG-6 https://electricmotorglider.com/ you can build it as an a 103 platform and if you do anything to improve it wham it now has to classified as an Experimental... I think that 254 pound rule is asinine... it may be time to march on Washington... what group of morons came up with that number anyway??? Boot them out.
     
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  2. Feb 6, 2018 #2

    mcrae0104

    mcrae0104

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    There are things you can do to improve an ultralight that don't increase its weight. There are also things you can do to improve an ultralight which increase its weight, and yet do not result in reclassification as experimental.
     
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  3. Feb 6, 2018 #3

    rbrochey

    rbrochey

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    Okay but I was talking specifically about the EMG-6 information that breaks down the FAA regulations regarding the build differences and subsequent classification results...
     
  4. Feb 6, 2018 #4

    BBerson

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    EAA said the FAA doesn't care if the 254 pounds is exceeded. So build it at 300 pounds. Just be sure it is one seat and 5 gallons.
     
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  5. Feb 6, 2018 #5

    Kyle Boatright

    Kyle Boatright

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    I'm surprised at that. EAA generally doesn't flaunt the rules. Where'd you read/hear it?
     
  6. Feb 6, 2018 #6

    rbrochey

    rbrochey

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    Really??? It's true I can't imagine them bringing scales to your house to weight it... more likely they would weigh all the broken fragments they scoop up after you spin into someones house...
     
  7. Feb 6, 2018 #7

    cluttonfred

    cluttonfred

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    The Part 103 limits are not onerous if you just want to get up in the air for local flights on nice days. They only become problematic if you want your ultralight fun machine be behave more like a regular general aviation airplane.

    In fact, there are workable designs like the Sky Pup that actually come in substantially under the limit, and even planes like the venerable TEAM MiniMax, Leonard Milholland's Legal Eagle and our own Ed Fisher's Skylite that look pretty "normal" despite being honest Part 103 ultralights.

    Do I agree that a more reasonable set of limits would make more sense? Absolutely. European single-seat microlight rules would be fine by me: 300 kg/661 lb max gross weight (+5% for a ballistic chute or +10% for floats/hull), 80 hp max, 65 kph/40 mph/35 kt landing speed (not stall speed, sustained slow flight flaps down at that speed).

    That said, Part 103 is one of the most open and generous flying regulations anywhere in the world: no certification, no inspection, no registration, no license, no instruction required (self-correcting). I suspect that any attempt to tweak Part 103 to allow more weight would put the whole category under a microscope and we might not like the end result.
     
  8. Feb 6, 2018 #8

    don january

    don january

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    Rob I'd say give Ken Peppard a call at 202-426-3128 and see what he can do to change the country we have become. I would love to see some push on resetting the 103 rule but holding my breath would be foolish. What Moron came up with the rules? I'd say someones great grand dad.:gig:
     
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  9. Feb 6, 2018 #9

    BBerson

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    At the annual Air Venture Ultralight forums from the EAA ultralight person.
    And the Dave Matheny column in Sport Aviation (August 2017, I think).
    I take it the FAA is ignoring the rules and perhaps gave EAA the permission to announce it quietly.
    Sort of like cops don't enforce the 55 mph speed limit in most places.
    Or the Feds not enforcing pot laws in legalized states.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2018
  10. Feb 6, 2018 #10

    Kyle Boatright

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    Honestly, the 254 lb limit is hard to strictly enforce. The airplane usually has fuel in it, the FAA isn't going to run around with calibrated scales to weigh a bunch of airplanes, etc., so you're not going to get busted on a random ramp check. I would think if you pushed 275 or maybe 300 lbs, you could skate by. Beyond that, you enter an area where "The Man" can eyeball your airplane and have a strong suspicion that you're outside the rules. Flaunt that, and someone is more likely to try and make an example of you.
     
  11. Feb 6, 2018 #11

    Turd Ferguson

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    All it takes is one complaint.........
     
  12. Feb 6, 2018 #12

    rbrochey

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    Okay... shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
     
  13. Feb 6, 2018 #13

    Tiger Tim

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    You Americans have in Part 103 probably the single greatest available personal freedom anywhere in the world. Don't ever forget that while you have just a couple hoops to jump through for a flying machine to be less regulated than a bicycle, there are countries that don't allow civil aviation. At all. So stop looking that gift horse in the mouth and ride the **** thing.
     
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  14. Feb 6, 2018 #14

    Himat

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    And to get an accurate weight the air probably must be dead still or the weighting have to be done indoors. As been said before on this forum, if it look like an ultralight and the wing area do conform to the template in the regulations the vehicle is considered an ultralight.
     
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  15. Feb 6, 2018 #15

    Himat

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    I do wonder if an inspector would notice a 5 imperial gallon fuel capacity. If it is possible to find a plastic fuel can marked with 5 gallons England.
     
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  16. Feb 6, 2018 #16

    pictsidhe

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    5 gallon cans tend to hold quite a bit more anyway. Maybe 6.

    And, what Tim said. Sure, it has restrictions, but it's amazing freedom in what is a pretty heavily regulated country. How many 1st world countries let you fly something with no paperwork, checks, or training?

    Some US cities don't allow you to hang laundry outside to dry...
     
  17. Feb 6, 2018 #17

    pictsidhe

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    Whatever you do, don't land your 300lb 'ultralight' on the whitehouse lawn.
     
  18. Feb 6, 2018 #18

    johnnyd

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    Great quote...:gig:

    "Stop looking that gift horse in the mouth and ride the **** thing."
     
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  19. Feb 6, 2018 #19

    b7gwap

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    Really well said, Tiger. I’m from the US but have been to several countries in Africa, Europe and Southwest Asia, and aviation is either out of reach to the average citizen (like part 91 in the US) or outright prohibited in some others. Part 103 is a vestige of a time when government didn’t feel like it needed to be so far down our throats as to be in our stomachs as they are today.

    I intend to ride this damned horse, nag though she may be. :)
     
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  20. Feb 6, 2018 #20

    BJC

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    I’ve spent four weeks in northern Europe, and not seen a single powered light airplane in the air. I did see three or four gliders. When visiting Cuba, aka Hollywood’s Utopia, I asked a tour guide about privately owned airplanes. She did not know what to say, because, even though she spoke impeccable English, she was unable to understand the concept of an individual owning an airplane. The cost of fuel in England, Europe, and Canada is, by our standards, outrageous. Ditto regulations, although I do wish that we would adopt some of the EU’s certification categories.

    Even though we complain, in relative terms, we have considerable freedom to enjoy private aviation in the USA.


    BJC
     
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