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What is an affordable ultralight?

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cluttonfred

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Fort Walton Beach, Florida, USA
Very cool, love that it’s a two-axis machine with a paramotor engine, the 4130 forward fuselage for crashworthiness and wood rear fuselage for ease and cost is a neat idea. My only nit to pick would be why mount the stab and elevator so close to the ground when taxiing? He’s going to need a taller, stiffer tail wheel spring.
 

karmarepair

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Jan 13, 2011
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204
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United States
again on the affordable vein:
Peter Sripol knocks it out of the park with his latest two axis rig
Looks much better than the last one. Yes, Mk3 came in under the legal limit, but there was no getting around the fact it was under powered.

I'll echo Matt, the placement of the horizontal stabilizer has me scratching my head. There must be a reason, but it looks at first glance like it could have been on TOP of the fuselage just as easily. I'm also curious about the covering system. Oratex?
 

Michael Silvius

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Jan 26, 2020
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62
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Maine USA
Very cool, love that it’s a two-axis machine with a paramotor engine, the 4130 forward fuselage for crashworthiness and wood rear fuselage for ease and cost is a neat idea. My only nit to pick would be why mount the stab and elevator so close to the ground when taxiing? He’s going to need a taller, stiffer tail wheel spring.
Yes the low hung horizontal stab surprised me too. I am thinking that should not be too hard to swap to the top.
 

Michael Silvius

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Jan 26, 2020
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Maine USA
Yes but that is without wings. It is a roadable potential airplane.

The wings should fold easily and quickly!
If I heard right he is planing on folding wings as he has lost the availability of his hangar and he needs to be able to trailer it home.
 

karmarepair

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CluttonFred
The Aeroplane XP by Mike Loehle is a better option because of the Elevator control.
I think you meant aileron control. And I think you meant Sport Parasol or SP, and your fingers just slipped. Loehle Sport Parasol - Wikipedia

Losing the ailerons simplifies the wings, both from a building complexity standpoint as well as structurally. AND the control system obviously gets simpler.
 

karmarepair

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If I heard right he is planing on folding wings as he has lost the availability of his hangar and he needs to be able to trailer it home.
I heard that he was planning REMOVABLE wings. FOLDING wings cost weight. I think he has gotten the weight control religion after the last plane that came in (if I understand correctly from watching his videos) 100 lbs over the original design weight (wanted 150 lbs, got 250 lbs, pretty awful on a percentage basis - please let me be clear I love what he's doing and he's getting a lot more DONE than I am). Same/same with 2 axis. That third axis costs weight, by increasing structural and control system complexity.
 

Michael Silvius

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Jan 26, 2020
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I heard that he was planning REMOVABLE wings. FOLDING wings cost weight. I think he has gotten the weight control religion after the last plane that came in (if I understand correctly from watching his videos) 100 lbs over the original design weight (wanted 150 lbs, got 250 lbs, pretty awful on a percentage basis - please let me be clear I love what he's doing and he's getting a lot more DONE than I am). Same/same with 2 axis. That third axis costs weight, by increasing structural and control system complexity.
Yes, you are right, he did say REMOVABLE. I had to go back and watch it again. And with no ailerons and associated hardware it makes wing removal/install way simpler too. I really like where he is headed with this one.
MS
 
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Dec 12, 2018
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Las Vegas, NV USA
Very nice looking aircraft, as far as I could tell, but I gave up on your website, it's horrible. Looks like you let your web designer go crazy with flash animations. You need a simple site where people can easily find information without waiting through all the cutesy effects.
I designed my own website using a Wordpress Template with zero experience (I'm sure it shows). It works for us perfectly. You should've seen it before I calmed it down, LOL.
BTW, If a couple scrambled menu headers and slides make you impatient, your airplane building patience will "tested" severely with any kit you choose. :)
 

BJC

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Oct 7, 2013
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97FL, Florida, USA
BTW, If a couple scrambled menu headers and slides make you impatient, your airplane building patience will "tested" severely with any kit you choose. :)
Good point. The right combination of persistence and patience is (would be) a real asset when building an HBA.


BJC
 

Victor Bravo

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Jul 30, 2014
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KWHP, Los Angeles CA, USA
I wish I could share some of my experiences trying to sell something to the GA community over the last eleven years, but truth be told I didn't listen to many of the people who wanted to share their experiences with me :oops: and none of it is appropriate on an E-AB forum anyway.
 

Bille Floyd

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Sep 26, 2019
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I wish I could share some of my experiences trying to sell something to the GA community over the last eleven years, but truth be told I didn't listen to many of the people who wanted to share their experiences with me :oops: and none of it is appropriate on an E-AB forum anyway.
What was that about ?

Bille
 
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Gregory Perkins

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May 25, 2019
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61
Location
Atlanta
Our Ultralight kits start at $11,700 base model and go to $29,000 for a full titanium frame. Ready to fly $20k-$40.
I would like to know if your company has ever actually welded up a Titanium frame as opposed to simply pricing out the tubing needed to complete one. I could easily look up the weight of TI compared to chrome moly for equal size tubing but I am not sure about the engineering and whether equal size would provide the same or too much strength. So if the engineering is done to only provide the minimum metal to equal the 4130 structure, what would be the weight savings of a titanium tube frame compared to a 4130 steel fuselage ? I just want to know what an extra $17,000 buys you. If I am not mistaken, welding titanium requires some very special and extreme environmental conditions at the worksite. Ultimately, I'd like to know if titanium could compete with a well engineered carbon resin structure and I tend to believe not because all the latest racing bicycles in the Tour De France are carbon and not Titanium. Same with the F-22. As an aside. What is the ancestry of the Badlands planes. Didn't they use to be Avid or Kitfox etc ?
 

Gregory Perkins

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May 25, 2019
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61
Location
Atlanta
There was also the Kolb Flyer, which looked like the Ultrastar but had two 15HP engines. It couldn't quite maintain altitude on one engine but it make a long shallow descent.
I am aware of a guy who put two Rotax 28hp motors with gearboxes on the Kolb Flyer
and it would climb on one engine eventually. Initially on a single engine takeoff attempt
the rudder would not keep the plane straight and nearly killed him. Later he installed a double size rudder using the same concept as the AirCam (tripled in size )and a single engine takeoff became possible though probably not smart. With the gearboxes a single Rotax had more thrust than both original Flyer motors together. I also think that the latest versions of Hummingbirds could climb with one engine out but not in a straight line. They even stated in the manual that to fly straight with one engine out you had to bank the plane with the ailerons and full rudder to fly straight and level. Sacrifice the level and you could climb.
 

pictsidhe

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Jul 15, 2014
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North Carolina
I designed my own website using a Wordpress Template with zero experience (I'm sure it shows). It works for us perfectly. You should've seen it before I calmed it down, LOL.
BTW, If a couple scrambled menu headers and slides make you impatient, your airplane building patience will "tested" severely with any kit you choose. :)
I found it nearly impossible to navigate the site, it's not just messy. A simple site that works is far, far better than a broken flashy one. You need to test a flashy site in all common browsers, and go back several versions. Not just the one on your PC.
Broken websites are a huge turn off. This is a potential buyer's first impression of you. If you can't manage a website, people aren't going to have much confidence in your engineering. If you can't do it yourself, throw $100 at a grateful kid and get something half decent.
 

Gregory Perkins

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May 25, 2019
Messages
61
Location
Atlanta
I spent two decades trying to get the designer of this plane to give me more details ... enough so to replicate the plane but no success. What I loved was the simplicity and that it had
folding wings and was a tractor. On the one photo I inserted red lines where I thought the tubes existed in the skeleton.
 

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