What do you think about "e-soaring"?

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John.Roo

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opcod

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Indeed, vinylester resin is bit less used, as for mostly same price your get higher modulus and strenght directly with epoxy. But all in all, for a mid term or very short term bird life, even Lepage white glue can make an airplane. It's about max load and proper design. Same as to paint the bird fully black : no problem there, just expect a midterm life and near 0 resell value.
 

John.Roo

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Indeed, vinylester resin is bit less used, as for mostly same price your get higher modulus and strenght directly with epoxy. But all in all, for a mid term or very short term bird life, even Lepage white glue can make an airplane. It's about max load and proper design. Same as to paint the bird fully black : no problem there, just expect a midterm life and near 0 resell value.
I personally also prefer expoxy resin and bright colors.
And in case of "glider like" airplane is white color acceptable ;)
 

henryk

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lower "thermal load" of airframe
=then GP gliders are made with high temperature resist epoxy resine...



-seriouse work...


=but noisy !
 
Last edited:

John.Roo

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=then GP gliders are made with high temperature resist epoxy resine...
That is good - than they can use different color 👍
It is possible to use high temp. resin and/or cure airframe with higher temperature (standard is 56°C).
However as OPCOD mentionned in post #1687
"Same as to paint the bird fully black : no problem there, just expect a midterm life and near 0 resell value."
Glider pilots are really conservative so even if you like to have different color of whole glider is good to think about future re-sell possibilities.
 

John.Roo

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Now a bit OFF-TOPIC about drawings...
I was wondering how could be possible to modify 2D sketch of Sagitta (for example) to imagine better shape and modifications.
How to do it quickly, +-acurate and using free software?
As source data I found only 3view file in PDF.

So... I conveted PDF into DWG.
(2 files a day are for free)
Than I imported DWG into SketchUp

Beginning - 2D sketch imported.
1633372111858.png
Practically it was only about rotation of side view, movement and "connection" to view from top, elevating wing 3°, moving the elevator....
All together was work for maybe 20 minutes (mostly erasing curves you don´t need) and finally I have 2D drawing in 3D space.
It is possible to rotate it and have basic impression about shapes.
1633370018710.png
1633370269697.png

Again....
It is just 2D drawing in 3D space.
No 3D shapes.

This is front view for better impression....
1633370633422.png
From top...
1633370724379.png
Funny how just "few degrees movement" change the perspective...
1633370763111.png
For basic quick "playing" is OK and very fast.

Of course it can serve aso like "base" for more detailed 3D model.
For example this is model of Discus 2 you can download and "play with" (change wing span etc.)
1633370941645.png

I hope you understand this is not "exact 3D software" like for example Solidworks.
This is supposed to be free tool for quick visualization of 2D sketch.

Can be done for sure also different way, but I found this way fast and simple ;)
 

WonderousMountain

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VE Resin will get near max E-glass strength value, we are talking about over 90% test specimen, likely the reason it's used in ParaBeam is resin uptake. Viscosity of VE is naturally low, cost remains under most epoxies, and promotion can be easily decreed.

So there is no special reason to change layup.

Where strength of composite exceeds fiberglass,
Epoxy would be an absolute necessity. Marine is
also important market for parabeam. Switching
to epoxy would not help parabeam boat market.
 

claude.bouzerand

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Hi everyone. I am following this thread since the first page and I want to tell you about my idea. I have the plans of the Bagalini Bagaliante for 20 years ... and this Ultralight elegant motor-glider has interesting characteristics to be converted for E-soaring.... Empty weight 110KG : 242pounds with a Rotax 277 (not the lighter one...) and here comes a number that is frightening me the gross weight with 11 liters of gasoline 185 kg ! : 407 pounds ! it means a very light pilot. I tried to find the designer or someone who built this motor-glider Not any news ! it is pity because the plans are very well done and this little glider seems to be a good floater . I just want to use Jim Marske's method to build the wings the wings. I feel a bit frustrated with these nice plans in hands and this question about the loading ratio. If Italian pilot or from other country, of course knows more about I'll be happy to know more This little plane will be a good recreational bird with a 15/20 KW electric motor and about 1 hour of power....

  • Maximum speed:
    87 km/h (54 mph, 47 kn)
  • Cruise speed: 60 km/h (37 mph, 32 kn)
  • Stall speed: 42 km/h (26 mph, 23 kn)
  • Rate of climb: 4.6 m/s (900 ft/min)


  • Length:
    6.40 m (21.00 ft)
  • Wingspan: 12.2 m (40 ft 0 in)
  • Airfoil: root: Gottingen 535, tip: NACA 4412
  • Empty weight: 110 kg (242 lb)
  • Gross weight: 185 kg (407 lb)
  • Fuel capacity: 11 litres (2.9 US gal)
  • Powerplant: 1 × Rotax 277 , 19 kW (26 hp)
  • Propellers: 2-bladed wooden
 

John.Roo

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Hi everyone. I am following this thread since the first page and I want to tell you about my idea. I have the plans of the Bagalini Bagaliante for 20 years ... and this Ultralight elegant motor-glider has interesting characteristics to be converted for E-soaring.... Empty weight 110KG : 242pounds with a Rotax 277 (not the lighter one...) and here comes a number that is frightening me the gross weight with 11 liters of gasoline 185 kg ! : 407 pounds ! it means a very light pilot. I tried to find the designer or someone who built this motor-glider Not any news ! it is pity because the plans are very well done and this little glider seems to be a good floater . I just want to use Jim Marske's method to build the wings the wings. I feel a bit frustrated with these nice plans in hands and this question about the loading ratio. If Italian pilot or from other country, of course knows more about I'll be happy to know more This little plane will be a good recreational bird with a 15/20 KW electric motor and about 1 hour of power....

  • Maximum speed:
    87 km/h (54 mph, 47 kn)
  • Cruise speed: 60 km/h (37 mph, 32 kn)
  • Stall speed: 42 km/h (26 mph, 23 kn)
  • Rate of climb: 4.6 m/s (900 ft/min)


  • Length:
    6.40 m (21.00 ft)
  • Wingspan: 12.2 m (40 ft 0 in)
  • Airfoil: root: Gottingen 535, tip: NACA 4412
  • Empty weight: 110 kg (242 lb)
  • Gross weight: 185 kg (407 lb)
  • Fuel capacity: 11 litres (2.9 US gal)
  • Powerplant: 1 × Rotax 277 , 19 kW (26 hp)
  • Propellers: 2-bladed wooden
Interesting 👍
Is this the airplane?
1633463914723.png
1633463976604.png
 

PiperCruisin

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