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proppastie

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for comparation=
I notice he did not hold 36 kg for more than a couple of seconds.....it would be interesting to see what the continuous power output might be.....I wonder how one might safely determine that without ruin of expensive components......would you have temperature sensors on the motor for example?
 

John.Roo

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I notice he did not hold 36 kg for more than a couple of seconds.....it would be interesting to see what the continuous power output might be.....I wonder how one might safely determine that without ruin of expensive components......would you have temperature sensors on the motor for example?
You're right. My post about "replacing the jet engine with a duct fan" was mentioned as a joke. RC models usually fly for a few minutes, so no one cares about engine temperature, cell temperature and battery life.
Monitoring of engine temperature, cell temperature and controller temperature is a necessity in serious aviation projects.
 

proppastie

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"replacing the jet engine with a duct fan"
36 kg trust for my UL powered launch might be enough...also the small size and convenience of the electric ducted fan is attractive......however if the climb is 100m/min. range one would need 10 min at high power to get to 1000m ......I think that perhaps it is possible in the near future......however it probably is more expensive than the simple propeller mounted on an electrical motor or ICE .
 

John.Roo

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36 kg trust for my UL powered launch might be enough...also the small size and convenience of the electric ducted fan is attractive......however if the climb is 100m/min. range one would need 10 min at high power to get to 1000m ......I think that perhaps it is possible in the near future......however it probably is more expensive than the simple propeller mounted on an electrical motor or ICE .
May I ask for more details about your UL?
Thxs in advance! ;)
Also in my opinion is standard propeller better and more affordable solution.
 

proppastie

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May I ask for more details about your UL?
see my build log page 1 has initial conditions

But why not?
but is it really 25kg each......if a one second blip of the throttle is what they are quoting I think one might be very disappointed, along with some very expensive burned/melted hardware.
 

John.Roo

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see my build log page 1 has initial conditions
Thanks!
Very good job👍 I will go thru your thread ;)
Really interesting.
 

John.Roo

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In Russia everything is possible - "hybrid" An-2 :cool:
8 electric motors + one turboprop. And I was thinking that is nearly impossible to surprise me :D

P.S.
Thxs Henryk for link to video on Youtube 👍
 

John.Roo

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Interesting are used small folding props :)
I will try to get more info about batteries, power of motors etc.

An-2 has ben real "worker" on our aeroclubs and I am glad that they are still working on new versions.
My favorite improvement is this one witn new wings design.
1627533556610.png
 

henryk

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new versions.

"БЕРКУТ"...


"Партизан", ТВС-2МС

Vmin=10 m/s (36 km/h), Vmax=300 km/h !
 
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proppastie

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An-2 has ben real "worker" on our aeroclubs
not understanding Russian I am not quite sure why they have added the electric motors.......surly the turbo prop is most of the thrust.....is it a test platform?.....do they turn off or feather the turbo prop at altitude to test the electric system?.....

how is the AN-2 used in the aeroclubs .....maybe jumpers?
 

henryk

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"Партизан", ТВС-2МС

=next step...
 

John.Roo

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=next step...
Thanks for the link Henryk - now I understand.
Main reason to use small electric motors on the wings is to achieve STOL characteristics.
They want to Takeoff and Land in area of 50x50 m with MTOM 3,38 ton airplane.
I suppose that turboprop engines will work also like a generators.

Why not? In GA will be "pure electric" propulsion difficult till some special batteries are available. Actually are succesfully flying GA projects like Ampaire and VoltAero - both using modified Cessna 337 (tandem propulsion - one electric and one ICE engine).

GA has more financial sources to play with high end technologies (investors, governament subsidies etc.). Typical homebuilder must use actualy available, affordable and safe systems.
Actually I would not start project of "fast electric cruiser airplane" bur self launch gliders are suitable for pure electric propulsion already. With 2-3 kW charger on board you can make also "crosscountry" flights. It will still require glider pilot skills, but there is a very good chance to be back at home airfield at the end of day. And have a LOT of fun :)
 

henryk

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small electric motors on the wings is to achieve STOL characteristics.
-yes, and in high speed cruise (<300 km/h) "electric" propellers are folded !

-probably this mode need to place 8 propellers under wing...?

BTW= hybrid project,500 kW...
 

John.Roo

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I red interesting info about price of batteries.
Article is in Czech. No problem to use translator however here are most important informations....

If you want to replace battery in Tesla, you have to pay for 75 kWh battery 13 500 USD.
If you want to change battery in Nissan Leaf you have to pay 7 500 USD for 40 kWh battery.
Audi eTron battery costs 35-38 000 USD (no info about capacity).

In other words....
Battery of Tesla or Nissan are arround 180-190 USD / 1 kWh.
Automotive industry is planning to go below of 100 USD / 1 kWh.

All prices are valid for Li-Ion cells. It means no super light future cells.
However if we would like to use 20-30 kWh battery (100-150 kg weight), than is actual price range 3 600 - 5 400 USD (Tesla prices).
That would be really nice for planes like electric Phoenix or Pipistrel Velis.
It would be possible to reach similar price for Rotax and electric version 👍
 
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