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pictsidhe

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2014
Messages
7,500
Location
North Carolina
There are good reasons for following a proven formula. But then again, proving a new formula is a good reason not to to just follow the plans!
It does help if you know what you are doing. I could be a bit more polite with some of the kids who show up, who don't know anything about aerodynamics, can't do math, and expect us to tell us the details (like, all the complex design!) that they need to make their wonder invention fly. Oh, god, not another drone! Hey, can I build a plane for $100 with no clue how to design one?
On the other hand, i was a newbie once. It's a bit intimidating. How do you start talking here without getting condescending comments form, well, the likes of me? I mostly stuck to reading threads for a long time before I said anything, so I had some idea what I was talking about. If I showed up today wondering how to design a plane, I'd likely tell me to read all the plans I could, buy some books from Orions book list, and read, a lot. Announcing your world shattering new idea in your opening post, not recommended. being sneaky and circuitous "hey, what do you guys make of the idea of man sized quadcopters?" A much better plan. We can tell you just what a horrible idea they are without having to personally insult your intelligence at the same time ;)
If I didn't value the opinions and knowledge of many of the seasoned veterans in here, I wouldn't ask questions, or read others technical threads. There's a lot of knowledge in here, sometimes it isn't always expressed very kindly.

New or radical ideas do get considerable resistance here. I was wondering if I should even bother mentioning my wing warping ideas but decided I was enough to take the crap i knew I'd get for it...
I have one person on permanent ignore, which is useful when searching old posts (topspeed). I'll occassionally get irked by someone and ignore them for a few weeks till the bone of contention gets buried in the flow of things.
As for radical planes. I keep hoping that Cheapie will build a bamboo and rice straw, dung powered aircraft for the 1 billion odd Chinese farmers to buy plans for.
 

BBerson

Light Plane Philosopher
HBA Supporter
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
13,224
Location
Port Townsend WA
Jack Lambie's "Hang Loose" glider plans said it was built for $26.38.
I bought the $3 plans and built one. Cost to build was probably more like $100.
I think he sold 3-5000 sets of plans.
 

timberwolf8199

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2011
Messages
279
Location
Grand Rapids area, MI, USA
Orion died
I too have noticed a change in the discussions since we lost him.

I, for one, go through posting cycles, perhaps because the topics that interest me seem to come in cycles.
Me too...I think we all do. However, that's one of the things that I think changed. I remember getting pulled into reading discussions previously simply because of the level of knowledge being provided; topics that were not within my interests at the time.
 

Little Scrapper

Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Log Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2014
Messages
5,711
Location
Wisconsin
It's a rare moment for me but I read every single post here word for word.

I disagree with most of the complaints here. I'm nothing special, just a working guy with a family that's trying to build and fly his airplane. I'll admit I come here just to see what a handful of people are talking about. People I hold in high regard. People I value. But really, everyone brings value here.

I have yet to ask a single question that wasn't answered.....to exhaustion. I asked a question a while back about composite equivalent to aluminum. I received absolutely wonderful answers and it turned in to a great discussion. Sure, sometimes it's a heated discussion but maybe there's value in that if it makes you think.

I had the opportunity to meet about 7 or 8 forum members here at Airventure. Absolutely wonderful people, I walked away knowing I was pretty lucky to have meet them. Mark Z had a wonderful and contagious smile and laugh. Raceair (Ed) has more dedication to old school aviation than anyone I've ever meet in this hobby. BJC is just a flat out honest person that anyone can call a friend. Chris in Marshfield, wonderful family guy just trying to enjoy the hobby like the rest of us even though it isn't always easy. Rockiedog (Joe) and I butt heads occasionally. We still managed to give each other a hug and laugh like two old time friends. Topaz and I became friends on Facebook, another awesome guy just trying to fit this hobby in to our busy lives. Kevin N, another awesome guy. McRae1014, another awesome guy. BBerson, another awesome guy. I could go on and on and on. I'd like to meet Pops, Cheapracer, Choppergirl, and a dozen others because in my experience most people in life are pretty awesome. See the trend???

So I guess I don't see a real problem. I guess I look at it through a different lens, a lens that says "don't talk, but do". The ultimate fix for anything that hurts this forum will be an individual at home who picks up a tool and says "I've decided to build". If that happens hopefully they can ask questions or share experiences here. I guarantee you people here will help, again, I've never once been refused help on any thread here. What am I missing?

Life is what you make it, and this forum is only as good as the people who contribute.

Edit: I met billski but dam if we didn't get a chance to sit down and chat. I regret that, it won't happen again. Looking forward to a sit down with him next time.
 
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proppastie

Well-Known Member
Log Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2012
Messages
4,558
Location
NJ
I used to ask very detailed technical stress analysis questions, probably got ignored because some of the questions were out of focus.... I did get very good answers and help that should have cost me thousands of dollars. At some point I learned enough to try to muddle through and stopped asking those questions. The most recent stress questions I have asked have been ignored probably because the analysis necessary was Nastrand FEA territory, and or the concept was too far from standard practice. Often my technical questions did generate more traffic from the "Aircraft Stress Proficient" or the "Aerodynamics Proficient". If those are the elite refereed to ....I would be nowhere without them. Thank you very much...you know who you are.
 

Winginit

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2016
Messages
811
Location
x
I used to ask very detailed technical stress analysis questions, probably got ignored because some of the questions were out of focus.... I did get very good answers and help that should have cost me thousands of dollars. At some point I learned enough to try to muddle through and stopped asking those questions. The most recent stress questions I have asked have been ignored probably because the analysis necessary was Nastrand FEA territory, and or the concept was too far from standard practice. Often my technical questions did generate more traffic from the "Aircraft Stress Proficient" or the "Aerodynamics Proficient". If those are the elite refereed to ....I would be nowhere without them. Thank you very much...you know who you are.
Elite doesn't refer to the technical knowledge that someone can help with, it refers to attitudes about ones own personal place in the HBA universe. I feel that everyone who participates makes a contribution that helps others. No one should be viewed as being any better, or any more prestigious than any other member. It is after all a "forum" that should allow equal participation and equal respect, even when perceptions and opinions differ. While its great that some posters have advanced training in specialty areas, I don't feel their contributions are any more ....or any less...valuable than someone who can tell you how to weld, how to bend metal, how to build an engine or inspect a part. Most likely there are more people who receive a benefit from the more general topics than the esoteric subjects. Have you not learned many things other than stress related information ? Aren't those tidbits just as valuable in the long run ? Do you judge posters by the subjects thaey are fluent in ? Aren't the people who contributed to your overall knowledge of building an airplane just as important to you as the ones who helped you with your stress education ?

Elite simply refers to a state of mind where someone feels that any opinion other than the one they have, should be culled from the view of the masses, and its their personal purpose in life to decide who gets to speak. In a democracy everyone can speak and then everyone can decide what they want to believe. Just as certain groups of rich and famous people in todays society try to limit speech and ideas they disagree with, so do some HBAers . Elite is about trying to prevent others from speaking, not about educational training.

The question posed by the OP was why HBA has dropped off in participation. My guess is that for every person who stayed on the site because they were able to learn about stress analysis or some esoteric subject, there were an exponential number that left the site because of boorish and insulting behavior.....
 
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BJC

Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Joined
Oct 7, 2013
Messages
11,223
Location
97FL, Florida, USA
... It is after all a "forum" that should allow equal participation and equal respect, even when perceptions and opinions differ.
Perceptions and opinions are welcomed in many threads / topics, but, except for discussion for the sake of learning, are not relevant to technical issues.
While its great that some posters have advanced training in specialty areas, I don't feel their contributions are any more ....or any less...valuable than someone who can tell you how to weld, how to bend metal, how to build an engine or inspect a part.
All education is valuable, and, as you wrote, there is plenty to be had here. Some of it happens via PM's to avoid the chafe.
... The question posed by the OP was why HBA has dropped off in participation. My guess is that for every person who stayed on the site because they were able to learn about stress analysis or some esoteric subject, there were an exponential number that left the site because of boorish and insulting behavior.....
Several regulars (and who knows how many lurkers) here participate in the EAA's forum. I tried it, experienced the boorish and insulting behavior, reached out to several of the individuals, when that didn't help I reached out to the moderator, then discussed it with her face-to-face at Oshkosh. Nothing changed, so I de-registered. HBA.com is orders of magnitude better, which is a testament to Jake, the moderators and the members here.


BJC
 

MikePousson

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2016
Messages
465
Location
Ontario on the bay
As I advance in age and decrease in health, my flying activities have decreased dramatically. My purpose of joining this group was/is to engage in conversation related to the subject of flying and homebuilding. I try to learn, just for the sake of learning, by reading different opinions. There’s a lot of “right on” knowledge here and then some that causes wonder, but that’s true in everything. Getting pulled in lots of directions with life things, I can go work on my little plane and get my feet planted and all is right in my world.
I do very much enjoy the experiences of those that share them on here, and the great humorous stories that are told. (That's you, Rockiedog). I guess we all have something to share
 

proppastie

Well-Known Member
Log Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2012
Messages
4,558
Location
NJ
Have you not learned many things other than stress related information ?
Gosh yes, fabric, painting, composites, and even metal working/design which is my professional field. I just ignore the bad and try not to be bad.

Also a reason might be because of the numerous other sites that popped up in the last few years....EAA and every other site dedicated to a specific aircraft.
 

Doggzilla

Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Messages
2,320
Location
Everywhere USA
There is a technical reason for the drop. If forums do not keep up to date with the most modern forum software, Google penalizes them. Ironically, changing the forum software often causes and even larger drop in visitors, so many forum owners are screwed either way
 

Doggzilla

Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Joined
Jun 2, 2013
Messages
2,320
Location
Everywhere USA
Also, there seems to be something broken with the forum. Google does return us as the top result, but our link looks like an ad because it shows nothing but our name. For some reason google shows nothing to describe the forum, unlike all the other forums.

 
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