SPG redrives from Air Trikes Enterprises Canada ?

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KeithO

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Does anyone have an opinion on the reduction drives offered by Air Trikes Enterprises ? The SPG 3/4 ? Sold / marketed by a Russian guy in Canada ? He seems to have been at it for a long time (supporting sales of the trikes that he has made in Russia) and unlike Raven, he does not use an HTD belt, his transmissions are more "Rotax like". It seems to be in the right power range for an engine like the Fit.

 

rv6ejguy

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Does anyone have an opinion on the reduction drives offered by Air Trikes Enterprises ? The SPG 3/4 ? Sold / marketed by a Russian guy in Canada ? He seems to have been at it for a long time (supporting sales of the trikes that he has made in Russia) and unlike Raven, he does not use an HTD belt, his transmissions are more "Rotax like". It seems to be in the right power range for an engine like the Fit.

By most accounts Vassili has provided good customer service on these drives and most have had a good experience with them too. Pricing is also pretty good.
 

Air Trikes

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I started converting and flying Suzuki G series in 1997. Air Trikes Enterprises registered in Canada in 2002. 200+ Suzuki G10 G13 G16 built by Air Trikes and our customers with our gearbox conversion systems.They are flying, our customers are satisfied. Some of first trikes have more than 1000 no trouble hours on G10 and G13BB. I don't make nice video presentations, I prefer building and flying my aircraft. 2 place trike built by Air Trikes, with my Suzuki G13BB engine is FAI World Champion 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019.
 

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Air Trikes

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We sell SPG conversion kits for Suzuki G ank K series, Honda L and D (Civic and Fit), Subaru EA and EJ, BMW R as well as Universal gearbox kits for aircraft, hovercraft, airboats. We supply other conversion parts and provide all possible customer's support. I personally test fly all the aircraft built with my engines. Typically I sell them with around 5 hours on each eng1.JPG tan1.jpg
 

cluttonfred

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Nice to hear from you directly on this forum, Vassili. Quick question...do you have a Suzuki engine package that would be comparable in power and the same firewall-forward weight (or less) than a 2180 cc VW conversion? Maybe something based on a G10 3-cylinder? Cheers, Matthew
 
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Air Trikes

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Yes, I sell SPG-3 based conversion for 3-cyl GEO-Metro Suzuki G10 engine. Around 65 HP, up to 386 lb static thrust. I think it will provide better performances than direct drive VW. Not only trikes but Jenny, Newport, CH-701, Kolb, Beaver etc. planes were built with these engines
 

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cluttonfred

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Thanks much. What is the approximate firewall-forward weight of one of those installations in a tractor layout?
 

rv7charlie

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New SPG-5 gearbox for up to 350-400 hp engines is available.
Hi Vassili,
It's good to see a drive available for higher HP applications. What engines/aircraft are flying with the SPG-5? Will it be available with SAE-2 pattern prop hub (typical Lycoming pattern)? Does it reverse engine rotation? If so, have you considered building a version with a countershaft gear to preserve 'standard' right hand rotation, as seen from the cockpit in a tractor a/c?

Last, price?

Thanks,

Charlie
 

Air Trikes

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Hi Vassili,
It's good to see a drive available for higher HP applications. What engines/aircraft are flying with the SPG-5? Will it be available with SAE-2 pattern prop hub (typical Lycoming pattern)? Does it reverse engine rotation? If so, have you considered building a version with a countershaft gear to preserve 'standard' right hand rotation, as seen from the cockpit in a tractor a/c?

Last, price?

Thanks,

Charlie
Hi Charlie,

This gearbox is under tests now, about 20 units are used on airboats and hovercrafts with Toyota and Honda high power engines. Yes, it can be ordered with SAE-2 adapter or shaft. Yes, it does reverse rotation, the same as most gearboxes. About the prices for SPG systems, I have a pricelist at my business website www.airtrikes.net
 

rv7charlie

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Hi Charlie,

This gearbox is under tests now, about 20 units are used on airboats and hovercrafts with Toyota and Honda high power engines. Yes, it can be ordered with SAE-2 adapter or shaft. Yes, it does reverse rotation, the same as most gearboxes. About the prices for SPG systems, I have a pricelist at my business website www.airtrikes.net
Thanks; I don't know why I missed the price list when I looked yesterday. Are you planning adapter kits for the larger engines like Toyota/Honda/GM LS motors, or are we on our own to adapt?

On the subject of prop hub, rotation, etc: If you don't mind, I'd like to offer a few thoughts that I feel might be typical for this market. Those of us flying RV-x and similar/larger a/c that are interested in alternative engines, are always looking for capable, reliable reduction drives. For us, the SAE-2 hub is effectively a requirement. Right hand prop rotation viewed from the engine is also very important, simply because it widens our prop choices. I realize that many smaller a/c, and a lot of European a/c use left rotation, but it is *much* simpler to get off-the-shelf props in these higher HP ranges if rotation is right-hand. Reduction ratios that enable Lyc-like rpm ranges (2700 prop rpm at full power) at sensible engine rpm are also important. A lot of us would like an option for a standard hydraulic prop governor to allow constant speed props, though I realize that is a big ask. Last is an issue that's pretty important, but rarely discussed. We need to know (even if we don't know that we need to know) the prop maximum mass moment of inertia the drive can handle. The issue doesn't come up much with smaller wood props, but as diameter and/or blade count goes up, or heavier controllable props are used, it can become critical.

Thanks for listening,

Charlie
 

Air Trikes

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Thanks; I don't know why I missed the price list when I looked yesterday. Are you planning adapter kits for the larger engines like Toyota/Honda/GM LS motors, or are we on our own to adapt?

On the subject of prop hub, rotation, etc: If you don't mind, I'd like to offer a few thoughts that I feel might be typical for this market. Those of us flying RV-x and similar/larger a/c that are interested in alternative engines, are always looking for capable, reliable reduction drives. For us, the SAE-2 hub is effectively a requirement. Right hand prop rotation viewed from the engine is also very important, simply because it widens our prop choices. I realize that many smaller a/c, and a lot of European a/c use left rotation, but it is *much* simpler to get off-the-shelf props in these higher HP ranges if rotation is right-hand. Reduction ratios that enable Lyc-like rpm ranges (2700 prop rpm at full power) at sensible engine rpm are also important. A lot of us would like an option for a standard hydraulic prop governor to allow constant speed props, though I realize that is a big ask. Last is an issue that's pretty important, but rarely discussed. We need to know (even if we don't know that we need to know) the prop maximum mass moment of inertia the drive can handle. The issue doesn't come up much with smaller wood props, but as diameter and/or blade count goes up, or heavier controllable props are used, it can become critical.

Thanks for listening,

Charlie
Hi Charlie,

We have adapters for different Toyota and Honda engines, they are ready. I got the order for Subaru EJ-25 Turbo, we will make it with SAE-2 flange. If you need a propeller, I can supply one, ground adjustable or variable pitch with appropriate moment of inertia.
I'm an engineer/builder/pilot, I personally make and fly Suzuki engines, but it doesn't mean we are not able to prepare PSRU for other engines.
 

rv7charlie

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Sounds good. I'm looking forward to seeing more info on the Toyotas & Hondas. that are flying.

Charlie
 

cluttonfred

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FWIW, I ran the numbers on an Evans VP-2 at full gross weight with a 64 hp Suzuki G10 and Air Trikes SPG-3 redrive. This is, of course, just a big fat guess using standard fudge factors/reference figures for induced drag, the NACA 4415 airfoil, and parasitic drag as well as Vassili's SFC numbers with the fuel-injected engine.

Crew weight 316 lb
Fuel weight 84 lb
Empty weight 640 lb
Gross weight 1040 lb
Wing area 130.0 sq ft
Aspect ratio 5.6
Wing span 27.0 ft
Mean wing chord 4.82 ft

Engine power 64 hp
Take off run 541 feet
Stall speed 46 mph
Glide descent rate at 59 mph 552 fpm
Max level speed 112 mph @ 4.2 gph
75% fast cruise speed 102 mph @ 3.1 gph
55% economy cruise 92 mph @ 2.3 gph
Rate of climb 971 fpm @ 59 mph

Obviously, these numbers underscore that the VP-2 is a single-seater with the option to take another adult (or a child if you are, ahem, larger) for a short hop. Still it will carry two (very cozy) 180 lb people and fuel for an hour-long local flight with comfortable reserve without going over gross weight. Solo, you'd actually have four hours of endurance and about 360 miles range with reserves if your bladder can handle it.

Overall, it's not at all bad for the stated mission *if* you can hold the line on empty weight. The 640 lb gross weight is the published figure from the VP-2 plans, I suspect that most VP-2s are heavier. Lighter wheels/tires, Oratex fabric, careful wood choice, maybe even a composite tailwheel spring should all help a little.
 
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