Some education if someone has the time, please

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ddoi

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Nov 20, 2009
Messages
19
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Ann Arbor, MI
Another option could be renting a 4 place plane for those occasional trips. Your "daily flier" could be a two seater.

An auto engine that falls in that power range you're talking about is the Mazda rotary. Tracy Crook of Real World Solutions retired and they stopped selling their reduction drives, ECUs, etc. The conversion manual is still available:

https://www.rotaryaviation.com/store/c7/Rotary_Aviation_Books.html

Have you seen Calbie Wood's Steve Wittman Tailwind inspired CF-4 Four Runner?:

http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/photo/000371374.htmlv
 

TFF

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Joined
Apr 28, 2010
Messages
12,580
Location
Memphis, TN
I am a big Tailwind fan, but I would not build the FourRunner. Not today. Where it fails is loaded up. Stall gets really high with that short wing. I would build the new wing Bearhawk in its place. It really is a great airplane that works in all facets. Fully loaded will not scare you. If I wanted a plane that landed like a Lear, might as well get the Lear.
 

PagoBay

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Joined
Nov 16, 2013
Messages
94
Location
US Territory of Guam
@ddoi ====An auto engine that falls in that power range you're talking about is the Mazda rotary. Tracy Crook of Real World Solutions retired and they stopped selling their reduction drives, ECUs, etc. The conversion manual is still available:
https://www.rotaryaviation.com/store/c7/Rotary_Aviation_Books.html====

As a past owner of a Mazda RX-7, I have to agree. Rotary is an excellent option. But seeing the hard work involved in bringing an auto conversion into the market would make anyone pause. There is the old saying "How to make a small fortune in aviation? Start with a big fortune."

Therefore....Hats off to Viking Honda and Aeromomentum Suzuki for bringing good options to the E-AB community.

Just saw this.... Aventura II, with Alex Rosinski owner of Aero Adventure, thrust testing complete and now ready for test flights with the Viking 130.

Quick summary here with many different aircraft:
https://vikingaircraftengines.ning.com/
SeaRey / Zenith 701(90hp) & 750(130hp) & SuperDuty (180hp) / KitFox / Rans S-12 / Just Aircraft / PoweraChute etc.

There is also the Russian kitplane SP-30 that is a CH-701 derivative. Used extensively in Russia for Ag Spray work. Search on YouTube with СП-30 and SP-30 for some well done videos on this aircraft. I have been talking with the USA distributor in Deland about this airplane. It is rugged with bigger tail feathers all push pull tubes for controls. Neat airplane.
 
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pfarber

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Feb 21, 2019
Messages
486
Location
Pennsylvania
Buy an EFI from SDS
SDS does have a decent product but there are more companies that sell standalone ECUs than them. SDS really doesn't do anything to make ECUs more airworthy, as anyone can install redundant ECUs and ignition systems. Honestly, an ECU with proper power regulation, vibration isolation and cooling has a very low chance of failure. An engine with coil packs is vastly more reliable than one using a central coil (you literally have a coil on each plug). Sure, a little more weight for COPs, but a stand alone ignition coil is pretty heavy and you will only have one spare. A v6 with COPs should never fail all 6 COPs unless the ECU dies.
 

pfarber

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Feb 21, 2019
Messages
486
Location
Pennsylvania
The thing that concerns me about PSRUs is that you are transferring all of that pulling force from the prop from the crank shaft to the output shaft of the PSRU. Bearings will be real important. Basically the whole weight of the airplane is being pulled by this one output shaft, not to mention the bolts that hold the PSRU to the bell housing of the engine. So basically the whole PSRU (casing and bearings) is to bear ALL of the thrust force. IDK... when you think about it, it's not as bad as holding the airplane up in the air hanging by the prop. The thrust force is only equal to the drag it is overcoming.... except for when it is climbing.
A proper PSRU's mounting should pretty much isolate loads from the prop from the crank. The PSRU mounting plate should have its own mount points and not rely on bellhousing bolts for flight loads. Some low power units may use use the engine block, but most higher HP PSRUs always seem to have a large plate to support the PSRU and front of the motor.

The PSRU prop shaft can easily take flight loads as most designs incorporate thrust bearings and a shaft supported on each end by roller bearings (sealed or with pressurized oil system)
 

pfarber

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Feb 21, 2019
Messages
486
Location
Pennsylvania
Engenfellner has a reputation for deleting unfavorable comments about his engines, threatening lawsuits on folks who speak out, and generally bullying away folks who do not like what they got for their cash. If you do business with him, I do hope you have a good engine and love flying it. But if you do not, remember that you were warned...
As someone who has run a customer service business I can tell you with 10000% certainty that most customers are idiots and expect much more than what they paid for. Ever hear of Yelp and the nonsense that goes on there? Any business would be smart to quash loudmouths. No, suing for slander is not an option.

Granted Engenfellner may have made some bad choices.. you take someones money you better deliver or refund.. but he's not alone in the E-AB world of failed/broken promises.
 

rv6ejguy

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Joined
Jun 26, 2012
Messages
3,749
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
SDS does have a decent product but there are more companies that sell standalone ECUs than them. SDS really doesn't do anything to make ECUs more airworthy, as anyone can install redundant ECUs and ignition systems. Honestly, an ECU with proper power regulation, vibration isolation and cooling has a very low chance of failure. An engine with coil packs is vastly more reliable than one using a central coil (you literally have a coil on each plug). Sure, a little more weight for COPs, but a stand alone ignition coil is pretty heavy and you will only have one spare. A v6 with COPs should never fail all 6 COPs unless the ECU dies.
In fact, no. We've got 25 years in this business and we've seen way more COP units fail than the coil packs we use. This is mainly due to heat down in the head and poor design. This is a main reason we don't recommend COP, especially on aircraft. The coil packs we use have isolated channels, the whole thing is not going to die.

Very few other companies are selling ECUs designed for aviation and none with even a small fraction of the experience we have in this field. I'll let our track record speak there. We also have several parts of our design which allows multiple sensor failures to happen and still keep the engine running- not the least of which is fully redundant boards. We have features than none of the other systems have (unless they copied our ideas)- in-flight adjustable individual cylinder trim, LOP switch which simultaneously leans and advances timing to give maximum power and efficiency etc.
 
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rv6ejguy

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Joined
Jun 26, 2012
Messages
3,749
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
A proper PSRU's mounting should pretty much isolate loads from the prop from the crank. The PSRU mounting plate should have its own mount points and not rely on bellhousing bolts for flight loads. Some low power units may use use the engine block, but most higher HP PSRUs always seem to have a large plate to support the PSRU and front of the motor.

The PSRU prop shaft can easily take flight loads as most designs incorporate thrust bearings and a shaft supported on each end by roller bearings (sealed or with pressurized oil system)
All PSRUs ultimately transmit flight loads into the engine block...
 
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