# runways

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#### skip SMITH

##### New Member
How do you calculate enough room for a runway? I'm going to get a ch 750 that could take off in 100ft. but I need to build it into the side of a small hill. I have about 800 ft length available but not quite yet a pilot. Would 50 feet wide be enough? I have trees on three sides and don't want to cut more than necessary, also I'm at 1957 feet.

#### jedi

##### Well-Known Member
50 feet is wide enough for the runway but it will be a narrow runway. The tree cutting needs to be three times that or more depending on the size of trees.

#### TFF

##### Well-Known Member
Three wingspans wide with obstacles on the sides would be my pick. Once the skill is there, you could fly smaller. It will feel like you are landing in a tunnel once below tree top.

#### Victor Bravo

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Which way are the prevailing winds coming from, compared to your proposed runway direction?

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#### proppastie

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
Not a pilot. ....maybe when you have couple hundred hours on the CH you will be safe to use an 800 ft runway.....

BJC

#### BJC

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Here is an HBAer performing a short takeoff in his then-new CH 701.

BJC

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#### proppastie

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
Its the landing that's the hard part.

#### blane.c

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Many small planes have wingspans in the thirty foot to forty foot range like say thirty two feet or thirty six feet etc. This means on a fifty foot wide runway you will have between eight and four feet outside of each wingtip, now envision doing a crosswind landing with that margin. Landing uphill will slow your roll considerably but of course will depend on the elevation difference between the top and bottom and you will want the parking area/ramp to be at the top of the hill. You can take a pretty significant tailwind into a uphill runway, again dependent on the elevation difference. If the hill is steep enough aborting a take-off will be nigh impossible, you need to be sure before you release the brakes trying to use them again may be futile.

#### Pilot-34

##### Well-Known Member
Are you comfortable flying under the local bridges ?
They are probably MORE than 50 foot spans.
My personal advice is to make it three times as wide as you need to build it and then make approaches to land until you can make one all the way to the ground without any pucker.

#### Pops

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Log Member
Neighbor used to have a strip on his farm about 20miles east. In the hills and hollows of WV. The deep hollow is a Y with the runway across the lower V of the Y. Go up the right side of the Y steep turn more than 90 degs, and the cut thru the trees to the other side of the Y, is about 2 Cessna 172's wing span. Fly up the hill to a level spot on top that is 1100' long. To turn around you have to put the C-172 wing tip into the small tree branches, hold the brake and turn around on the one stopped wheel and the other wing tip will hit some small branches of the trees on the other side. On take off, as you go over the end of the runway the ground drops down 45 degs for about 200' and the other side of the narrow hollow is in you windshield , so as soon as your wing tip will clear the edge of the runway you drop the nose and do a steep bank to the left and fly down the hollow to climb out.

Neighbor left his 1965 STOL wing C- 172 there one day and came home with his wife in the auto. Few days latter wanted me to fly him to get his 172 in my 1956 C-172, I have never been there before so he said he would talk me into it. I told him we will go deeper into the landing on each approach until I get it right. First try when flying up the hill, I told him "I like it" and put it on the end of the 1100'. He told me what to do for the take-off. He quit flying to the farm when he got about 82 years old.
WV bush flying.

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#### skip SMITH

##### New Member
Which way are the prevailing winds coming form, compared to your proposed runway direction?
Almost head on , in the am about 15 degrees off the nose but since i have 2 possible locations, I'm gonna put up a sock and test direction

#### Victor Bravo

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Go up the right side of the Y steep turn more than 90 degs, and the cut thru the trees to the other side of the Y, is about 2 Cessna 172's wing span. Fly up the hill to a level spot on top that is 1100' long.

On take off, as you go over the end of the runway the ground drops down 45 degs for about 200' and the other side of the narrow hollow is in you windshield , so as soon as your wing tip will clear the edge of the runway you drop the nose and do a steep bank to the left and fly down the hollow to climb out.
Am I the only one here who would buy a full-price movie theater ticket to see the video of this?

#### Pops

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Log Member
Am I the only one here who would buy a full-price movie theater ticket to see the video of this?
Not the worse runway in the area. About 10 miles south of neighbors farm strip the is another strip is against the side of a high hill in a steep hollow.
If you slip real hard in my C-172 with 40 Degs of flaps ( please don't read the POH) down the side of the hill, down in the hollow, cross a gravel road and a small creek , the runway looks like a logging road straight up the other side of the hill. Go to full power, CLIMB and land and DO NOT SLOW DOWN. About 1500' long and so steep that if you stop with a tri-gear it will fall back on its tail. Big problems. The only thing you can do is let off the brakes enough to let it roll backwards and lock one wheel up so you get it sideways. The Mr Stoneking will get his farm tractor and pull you up to the top where there's a flat spot large enough to turn around . Back up slowly so when you make the turn the down hill wing tip doesn't hit the ground.
I ask Mr. Stoneking about taking off. Says, " As you go down the side of the hill, keep the nose down the turn with the wing tip on the tree stump and fly down the hollow and climb out ". Retired airline pilot and Blimp pilot.

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#### Pilot-34

##### Well-Known Member
That reminds me Of a field they told me started out as a helicopter pad
It’s about 1500 feet right up the side of the mountain to a flat spot there’s nobody else around to help so you have to have enough momentum to get up the hill and stop at the flat spot on top but don’t worry if you’re going to fast there’s another 1500 feet on the opposite side going back down the hill to fly off of.
I’ve never actually landed there but I’ve always visualized an interesting afternoon watching one stubborn guy landing on it again and again trying to hit the top with exactly the right amount of momentum.
Supposedly it’s right on the US Canadian border which begs the question
If someone crashes there where do they bury the survivors?

#### TFF

##### Well-Known Member
Solo with no fuel, everything becomes somewhat of a hot rod. If you are packing in, it’s a different game. This Palmer video doesn’t have the tree coverage, but high DAs and limited fields. It never looks like a STOL contest when you are using the plane to capacity.

#### Pops

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Log Member
Yes, real life is different. Sorry-- I can't take his videos.

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#### TFF

##### Well-Known Member
They are lifestyle videos not technical aviation ones. Only if you know aviation can you pick that stuff out. There really about being 30 and owning an airplane.

#### speedracer

##### Well-Known Member
50 feet is wide enough for the runway but it will be a narrow runway. The tree cutting needs to be three times that or more depending on the size of trees.
I'd go for the 150' wide runway. After your skills improve, replant the trees.

#### Pops

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
Log Member
They are lifestyle videos not technical aviation ones. Only if you know aviation can you pick that stuff out. There really about being 30 and owning an airplane.
I know. Change that to big city 30's. Rednecks are a little easier for take for me, since I'm just an old redneck Hope I wasn't like that at 30 years old.
If I was, I'll never tell.

TFF