# Raptor Composite Aircraft

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#### BJC

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
I strongly suspect that Peter is scared to fly his baby. That suggests he is much smarter than he pretends to be.
I’ve only watched a couple of the videos, but I came to the same conclusion. That should not be taken as criticism; take it as Peter’s facing reality.

BJC

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#### 231TC

##### Active Member
Some nice pixels though. In fact, they "architected" the s*#† out of them.

Oh, lord, do I hate that. It's design. Architects design buildings and the built environment. They don't "architect" helicopters. A mechanic does not say "Sir, I have finished mechanicing your engine." LOL.
Pretty sure they're Brits. They talk that way sometimes.

#### TarDevil

##### Well-Known Member
I’ve only wathed a couple of the videos, but I came to the same conclusion. That should not be takes as criticism; take it as Peter’s facing reality.

BJC
I've changed my mind to no longer believing that machine will safely circle the field. I think it will shake itself to pieces at pattern speed. I agree Peter is coming to terms with his mortality.

#### Tiger Tim

##### Well-Known Member
That’s a tall order to put out in the 6,829th post in this growing thread. I mean I agree wholeheartedly but yeesh.

#### BoKu

##### Pundit
HBA Supporter
The problem with this thread is it has been hashed out multiple times. An extra round happens when a new HBA member discovers the thread and there is a recap...
Another aspect of this thread is the episodic nature of the Raptor project itself. Each week or so there is a new video that contains some valuable insights into how to not design or develop an airplane. And I think those insights are fair game for new posts. The reason it sometimes seems like we're going around in circles is that the project seems to be hitting some of the squares again and again. With "ignore weight" and "ignore stiffness" getting so much repeat traffic, it'll be a while before I get a bingo even with the free square in the middle.

#### cheapracer

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
we're going around in circles
I like watching motor racing, guess what do they do ......

I strongly suspect that Peter is scared to fly his baby. That suggests he is much smarter than he pretends to be.
I think the 2 ground effect flights may have woken him up to reality.

#### 231TC

##### Active Member
I also think he's somewhat scared, but unfortunately I don't think it's deterring him, only delaying him while he works up his nerve to go for it anyway. He's facing reality, but trying to overcome it rather than accepting it.

That said, it's unlikely it'll kill him on the first flight. But that may build unwarranted confidence and lead to more. Eventually something bad is going to happen. My bet* is still on the PSRU self destructing. Where it happens is really the big variable in determining how bad that could be.

*When I say "bet" I don't mean to take it lightly, just my guess of what's most likely to catastrophically fail first. I don't know the guy, but I would hate to see anything bad happen to him.

#### flywheel1935

##### Well-Known Member
Pretty sure they're Brits. They talk that way sometimes.
I say old boy, taking the mickey out of us Brits is simply not cricket, !!!!
But at least we built the SPITFIRE TALLY HOE, Cabbage Crates Over The Briney, Angels 15.

#### Dantilla

##### Member
The problem with this thread is it has been hashed out multiple times.
I have found this thread very valuable.
As a guy who has done nothing but assemble airplane kits designed and engineered by others, I am learning quite a bit about the engineering side.
Just one recent example, the discussion of proper turbo sizing, and where the Raptor's current setup is lacking.
Sure, any thread of 300+ pages has lots of fluff, and "me too" posts, but just like mining for gold, ya gotta go through a lot of dirt to find a nugget or two.
I find the nuggets in this thread well worth it. And sometimes the fluff is entertaining.

#### pictsidhe

##### Well-Known Member
That’s a tall order to put out in the 6,829th post in this growing thread. I mean I agree wholeheartedly but yeesh.
Reading the first one on each page would give an idea.

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#### jetrep

##### New Member
New video was just released. He performed another static engine test. The brakes could not keep the airplane from rolling during the test. Sure seems like the brakes are insufficient.

#### Kyle Boatright

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
New video was just released. He performed another static engine test. The brakes could not keep the airplane from rolling during the test. Sure seems like the brakes are insufficient.
That's not unusual. As long as the brakes will hold it at run-up power, they are sufficient on that metric. I think he's a little short on brakes on other metrics (stopping power, fade resistance), though.

#### 231TC

##### Active Member
Heck, some planes I've flown won't even hold still for a run-up...you have to do a rolling run-up. Not ideal, but workable.

At full power? No concern there. That's not a scenario that ever presents itself in normal operation.

#### jetrep

##### New Member
Heck, some planes I've flown won't even hold still for a run-up...you have to do a rolling run-up. Not ideal, but workable.

At full power? No concern there. That's not a scenario that ever presents itself in normal operation.
Good to know. I haven't flown any high power stuff.

#### dodgemich

##### New Member
I know he's not targeting certification, but Part 23 certification req's state that a plane should be able to hold on the ground with the brakes at takeoff power, other than tire slippage. Can't say I've seen many comparable piston singles creep on the ground myself.
Code:
23.735(b)  Brakes  must  be  able  to  prevent  the wheels from rolling on a paved run-way  with  takeoff  power  on  the  critical  engine, but need not prevent movement of the airplane with wheels locked.
Seems more like he's got a new braking issue like glazed discs again...with a turbo'd engine, I don't think he magically picked up that much power/thrust from "cold air", especially as Valodsta's been in the 70s still.

#### BJC

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
I know he's not targeting certification, but Part 23 certification req's state that a plane should be able to hold on the ground with the brakes at takeoff power, other than tire slippage. Can't say I've seen many comparable piston singles creep on the ground myself.
My Pitts brakes will keep the wheels from turning at full power, but the tires skid.

BJC

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#### donjohnston

##### Well-Known Member
That's not unusual. As long as the brakes will hold it at run-up power, they are sufficient on that metric. I think he's a little short on brakes on other metrics (stopping power, fade resistance), though.
I don't know about that. Doing the fuel system adjustment on a Continental IO550 requires checking fuel flow at full power. I've never needed anything but the brakes to do those checks.

#### BBerson

##### Light Plane Philosopher
HBA Supporter
The old Part 23 is out.
New part 23 is not prescriptive.
§23.2305 Landing gear systems.
(a) The landing gear must be designed to—

(1) Provide stable support and control to the airplane during surface operation; and

(2) Account for likely system failures and likely operation environments (including anticipated limitation exceedances and emergency procedures).

(b) All airplanes must have a reliable means of stopping the airplane with sufficient kinetic energy absorption to account for landing. Airplanes that are required to demonstrate aborted takeoff capability must account for this additional kinetic energy.

(c) For airplanes that have a system that actuates the landing gear, there is—

(1) A positive means to keep the landing gear in the landing position; and

(2) An alternative means available to bring the landing gear in the landing position when a non-deployed system position would be a hazard.

#### Kyle Boatright

##### Well-Known Member
HBA Supporter
I don't know about that. Doing the fuel system adjustment on a Continental IO550 requires checking fuel flow at full power. I've never needed anything but the brakes to do those checks.
Yours holds. Great. Doesn't make it a requirement.

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