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Raptor Composite Aircraft

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Kyle Boatright

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But then after that first flight, is he going to think he's now qualified to do all the testing? Wouldn't surprise me.
The problem isn't if he's qualified to do the testing. He's a pilot, a CFI, etc. With transition training, he should be able to fly it if it has reasonable characteristics.

The problem is all of the truly terrible "features" in the aircraft, like the PSRU, the fuel return system, the undersized brakes, the questionable controls, the gear/prop geometry, the single ECU, the inadequate cooling system, and the seeming low power to weight ratio. At some point, one of those is going to rear its head and give him a bad day. Those shortcomings are why the Wasabi guys and one other potential test pilot "noped" the project. Realistically, he shouldn't try and fly it before fixing all of those things. It ain't about the suitability of the pilot here. It is about the unsuitability of the aircraft.
 
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pictsidhe

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Some training in Velocity is a great idea on so many levels.
Right now, Peter can attribute any 'quirky' behaviour to the Raptor being a canard. If he flies a Velocity, he will have first hand experience of how a good canard design is supposed to fly.
This is also a win-win for Velocity. They know the Raptor is no competitor. While Peter may well comment on the Velocity being 'cramped', he is not going to be saying the Raptor flies anywhere near as well. It should be a much needed bucket of icy water for him.
 

Volzalum

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Those shortcomings are why the Wasabi guys and one other potential test pilot "noped" the project.
I believe Wasabi is still willing to fly it, PM just does not want to bring them out again. In their video (Wasabi), they said the squawks were addressed only the airport location was not acceptable.
 

Kyle Boatright

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I believe Wasabi is still willing to fly it, PM just does not want to bring them out again. In their video (Wasabi), they said the squawks were addressed only the airport location was not acceptable.
You may be right. Wasabi might fly it at a better airport. That's what they said. On the other hand, since Peter was a paying customer, that might have been their best way to exit the project without eviscerating their client.
 

231TC

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The problem isn't if he's qualified to do the testing. He's a pilot, a CFI, etc. With a transition training, he should be able to fly it if it has reasonable characteristics.
I wouldn't say those things qualify him to expand the envelope of a new design safely, but again I'm OK with him risking his own safety. My real issue with his qualifications is I don't think he has a clue what he needs to test or how to do it.

The problem is all of the truly terrible "features" in the aircraft, like the PSRU, the fuel return system, the undersized brakes, the questionable controls, the gear/prop geometry, the single ECU, the inadequate cooling system, and the seeming low power to weight ratio. At some point, one of those is going to rear its head and give him a bad day. Those shortcomings are why the Wasabi guys and one other potential test pilot "noped" the project. Realistically, he shouldn't try and fly it before fixing all of those things. It ain't about the suitability of the pilot here. It is about the unsuitability of the aircraft.
Well, yeah, those are all problems, too. But the suitability of the pilot is probably a big factor also, since if it's him, it's the same guy who created that mess of other problems and is fine with it. His aeronautical judgment seems lacking, to put it mildly.
 

BJC

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I’m trying to imagine just what the NTSB, with so many options, will identify as the root cause.


BJC
 

TFF

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I think Velocity is trying to lend a helping hand. They would rather have competition on merit not elimination. I don’t think PM can accept on ego.

True fight test program. No.

I bet Wasabi would fly it out of Valdosta. At least once. It’s much better than the original Airport, which was the main hiccup. I don’t think PM can take another rejection, so he is not going to even ask. Ego.

I think he does not want to discuss issues anymore. A real flight test would uncover issues or bring old ones back up. What is he going to do if it is discovered a whole bunch of stuff needs to be fixed better. We all know our list. A real acknowledgement to himself that stuff has to be really fixed not scabbed on, would probably break him. Like 6 months to a year to fix before a second flight. He has get home-itus. He is looking for some breathing room.
 

pictsidhe

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He has so many things that need total redesign and rebuild. He is disastrously overweight. He doesn't even know why so many of his ideas aren't working, so he has no chance of fixing much properly.

What Peter needs now, is a hurricane. If he has inadequate insurance, he has a valid out from rebuilding.
 

BBerson

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Assuming the control tests are completed the next step is to estimate climb rate. I would try to estimate how much power is required to maintain minimum level flight within the ground effect tests. Then he needs about 6 additional thrust hp to climb 60 feet per minute or about 60 additional thrust hp to climb at 600 feet per minute. (3400 pounds)
 

cheapracer

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.... a hurricane. If he has inadequate insurance, he has a valid out from rebuilding.
Lightning strikes are well known to cause fires ....

Like many teenagers, my first cars were cheap old ones, many a time on a hot day I have had the heater on to keep the engine temp out of the red...
 

Kyle Boatright

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What Peter needs now, is a hurricane. If he has inadequate insurance, he has a valid out from rebuilding.
With insurance, he could start with another "shape" pulled from the molds and install better systems. Like an IO-540, decent brakes, and a bunch of redesigned systems, generally following convention this time. There's no reason V2.0 couldn't work. He could read this thread and the comments from knowledgeable youtube participants and improve things considerably.

Honestly, there's no reason a 2nd one should take nearly the cost and time the first one has.
 

bmcj

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Is there any runway like one of these here in the US where he might move for first flight?
No dead zone for the BRS at these. :pilot:
Catalina comes to mind, as well as a large private airstrip I flew into in Arizona (or was it New Mexico) years ago that was built atop a mesa by a warbird collector that needed a big flat runway.
 

pictsidhe

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Assuming the control tests are completed the next step is to estimate climb rate. I would try to estimate how much power is required to maintain minimum level flight within the ground effect tests. Then he needs about 6 additional thrust hp to climb 60 feet per minute or about 60 additional thrust hp to climb at 600 feet per minute. (3400 pounds)
Wasn't he predicting 3000?
I better stock up on popcorn.
 

BBerson

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The estimated climb rate of 1600 fpm on the website specs is meaningless.
The test pilot needs to instantly sense the climb ability based on nuances that Langewiesche would call "bouyancy".
Time in a Cessna 150 would be more useful than a F-15.
 
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flywheel1935

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Is there any runway like one of these here in the US where he might move for first flight?
No dead zone for the BRS at these. :pilot:
Hi Guys, don't forget it's a Pusher !!!! My money would be the BRS going through the prop, or wrapping around the spinner. I guess in his head, the Raptor is 'Tail Heavy', so the BRS would land the a/c arse down, forgetting it's moving forwards pulling the chute rearwards, but, He's fine with that. :bow:
 
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