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Raptor Composite Aircraft

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Turd Ferguson

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
5,236
Location
Upper midwest in a house
Dyno testing of the combined engine-reduction drive system seems like a really cost effective way to build confidence in that system and reduce risk. After watching Elliot's video it seems like the Raptor engine was tuned by just trial and error and "sounds about right".
No, there’s a video on engine tuning. Peter watched a webinar then tuned it. Should be good to go..,.,
 

pictsidhe

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Joined
Jul 15, 2014
Messages
8,076
Location
North Carolina
Peter is the one who put this project on the public track from day one. It’s kind of hard to pull that back at the critical stage without raising some investor’s eyebrows.
Peter has been showing us informercials. It is now quite plain from Elliot's latest video that he has only bee showing us a little of the bad stuff.
 

pictsidhe

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2014
Messages
8,076
Location
North Carolina
My engine will get a lot of full throttle ground running. Since I'm a cheapskate without millions of dollars of other people's money, I'll use an Eiffel club or three. Made from Lowes lumber. It's not rocket science. My only headache on doing this is finding somewhere suitable. Back yard in the city won't go down too well for long tests.
 

aeromomentum

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2014
Messages
119
Location
Stuart, FL USA
Dyno testing of the combined engine-reduction drive system seems like a really cost effective way to build confidence in that system and reduce risk. After watching Elliot's video it seems like the Raptor engine was tuned by just trial and error and "sounds about right".
I am not sure what other engine developers do but we have 2 in house dynos and have spent well over 1000 hours running time on the dynos for development, tuning and testing. While we have also tested our gearbox on another dyno, the dyno does not provide the same or even similar inertial loading that a prop provides so additional prop testing is still required.
 

Rod Schneider

Active Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
31
Location
Ball Ground, GA. About 40 miles north of Atlanta
Another quirk of the engine ECU programming---A while back, in one of his videos, Peter mentioned a "feature" of the ECU that would automatically dial back the power if the engine was beginning to run too hot! So, think about this scenario. Initial climb out and the engine begins to overheat. Gonna need to get it back on the ground fast. Should be able to do a 180 and get back to the runway, even if it means possible engine damage. Oh, wait, I can't get full power now because the ECU is trying to "protect" the engine. No way to make the runway now. Going to have to land off airport. Might destroy the airplane, but at least the engine is not damaged from running too hot!!! This is very typical of his way of thinking.
 

CameronB

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Joined
Jan 25, 2012
Messages
68
Location
North Florida, West Tennessee
I’m betting on high pressure fuel pump failure, look up Bosch CP4 lawsuit to see the problems all the OEMs have with them. Plus Peter has the fuel rail pressure jacked to almost double what OEMs tune their engines to. Can live long like that, especially after you add in using jet A instead of diesel.
 

ScaleBirdsScott

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Joined
Feb 10, 2015
Messages
1,258
Location
Uncasville, CT
To be quite fair to Peter while he is showing the positive outlook on all this from his side, I think he's earnestly showing his side of the story. He's unaware of the best or "proper" way to solve a lot of these issues, he's learning as he goes, and while sometimes he acts incredulous at the need for certain tasks he does eventually seem to do them and it seems he tends to come away from those experiences satisfied in the outcome having been worthwhile.

His positive outlook lately has been strained by all the reality catching up, the things he's learning, and I think bit by bit he's starting to get some of it just by being faced with the bill of it all. The lack of experience and knowledge really clearly comes through when seen from the Wasabi video, but it makes plain that he's not so much intentionally hiding the bad stuff, because he simply doesn't know what's bad and should be hidden.

When he has all these deep complicated explanations for how certain things that should just work all have their certain way of making it work, it's clear he's worked it out in his head that it all makes sense and that specific thing might be slightly odd but it works fine; but I don't think he has taken the moment to step back and reflect on all of those quirks in aggregate and whether they add up to the type of machine someone wants to jump into. He's gotta explain every little thing and justify it. He doesn't see that as an issue cuz he has lived with all this knowledge for years. And one or two quirks is probably fine. But everything here has things that just don't quite work right, and so while it works-ish. it's all clearly half-finished prototype stage solutions. And in retrospect when there's a better design worked out (hopefully) he'll clearly see how far he had to go.

But that's the future.

But somewhere I think he knows there are big gaps in his personal experience, which is why despite all of his hubris at times, he still knows enough (I want to hope) to continue to defer to people with experience and real critical eyes when it comes to flying the thing, and has to have inside his mind at least a bit of the real concern that the creature may bite.
 

Victor Bravo

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Joined
Jul 30, 2014
Messages
7,763
Location
KWHP, Los Angeles CA, USA
I watched a little of Wasabi's video and came away with the overall impression Peter is not a sleazebag, a huckster, or a late-night infomercial fast-talker. Misplaced confidence... sure, over-zealous... sure, wishful thinker... sure.

Not exactly Kelly Johnson... absolutely.

Again, this is an instant gut feel based on 20 minutes of a third party's video. No other info than that.
 

BJC

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HBA Supporter
Joined
Oct 7, 2013
Messages
11,558
Location
97FL, Florida, USA
I watched a little of Wasabi's video and came away with the overall impression Peter is not a sleazebag, a huckster, or a late-night infomercial fast-talker. Misplaced confidence... sure, over-zealous... sure, wishful thinker... sure.
I agree with all of that, VB; however, when someone advertises a product, proclaims that it will be superior to the current state-of-the-art, accepts deposits (even if held in escrow), then he is obligated to be reasonably competent to deliver. He was not.

I credit him with getting lots done. Who knows; if the aero is OK (still a question in my little mind), he may have learned enough to produce a second prototype that might be a reasonable fat airplane. Even then, I do not believe that it will be capable of being built for the cost he has advertised, nor do I believe that it will have the Cirrus-beating performance that he has proclaimed.

I continue to feel for him; he has committed way beyond his capability.


BJC
 

flywheel1935

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
297
Location
Downham Market, Norfolk, UK.
Think one of my favorite bits of the Wasabi YT Video, was when Peter was showing Justin the Brake Discs, and his response was. 'Do you want to save the Brakes or the Aircraft' !!!. What also seemed to come across was Peters reluctance to actually make 'eye contact' & engage with the guys. It also seems that the choice of airfield had been mentioned before, and you have to ask if Peter had actually flown into/out of or even over Cherokee Airfield. He (Peter) just seemed dismissive of some of the things that needed addressing, such as the trailing edge delamination, right rudder operation, and the low rpm and engine stall, oh and the chance of losing all electrical power whilst in flight, (Although it was too low to restart the engine). My money is still on Peter trying out first flight himself, but just hope he doesn't. :pilot::rolleyes:
 
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B52

Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2015
Messages
7
Location
Oz
I can see issues developing with the PSRU not being structurally integrated into the engine block. Overall this guy and his supporting team fully deserve the golden buzzer ...
 

berridos

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2009
Messages
961
Location
madrid
If there is a delimination at this place, there is a 90% probability that there will be delamintions elsewhere and that the glue fillets are insufficient. Did he do bag load testing?
 
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