Question for you welders..

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badger

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Hi guys..

I honestly dont know a lot about welding. It's just something that I never really got in to, I guess. I done a little "brazing" from time to time with oxy/acc torch, but thats about it.....and never was any good at it really.

My son bought a little 70 amp arc welder for to do some body work on his jeep, and it looks to do pretty good on that automotive metal. My question is this:

I have had a pace-maker for about 4 years now, and the docs said that I cant get around any arc welders and such....or strong magnets, as in slot machines, etc.....I cant even be close to a vehicle when it's running with the hood up, due to the alternators amp output.....because the pacemaker may go all screwy and stuff. So I'm wondering....the Mig and Tig welders, and wire feed, and all that.....do those kinds of welders put out amperage like arc welders, or car alternators do? Or is it, if I want to weld, I better get good with the torch and welding tips?
Thanks guys..

John
 

JMillar

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Antigonish, NS, Canada
Wirefeed welding ( which would be MIG and flux-core) and TIG, are both arc welding processes. Just an arc welder at heart, with refinements.
If the pacemaker is that sensitive, you will be limited to gas welding only.

Oops... the lame " at heart" pun, was accidental.
 

Midniteoyl

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Chances are, you might get away with light welding. You could also put the actual welder (where the coils reside) behind a grounded metal wall/room and 'twist' the lead and ground cables together to reduce the EM field surrounding them.

Welding

Because of the random nature of the electromagnetic energy generated during welding (including AC arc, DC arc, MIG, TIG, plasma), it is difficult to predict the effect on your pacemaker or defibrillator.
  • The electromagnetic energy generated from a welding arc can cause your pacemaker to continuously pace the heart. If your heart is beating on its own, this will result in an irregular heart rate or palipitations.
  • The intense electromagnetic energy generated when spot welding or starting a bead may cause your pacemaker (including the pacemaker function of a defibrillator) to pause temporarily if it were pacing your heart. The symptoms would be dizziness or lightheadedness.
  • Your defibrillator could detect the electromagnetic energy from the welder (especially when spot-welding) as a fast heart rhythm, causing it to deliver a shock. (-- OW!)
Any effect on a pacemaker or defibrillator is temporary.
Using these tools will not cause any permanent damage or re-programming to your pacemaker or defibrillator. Any effects that occur will end when the welding is stopped or when the chain saw is turned off.
  • Limit welding current to a 60 to 130 ampere range.
  • Work in a dry area with dry gloves and shoes.
  • Keep the welding cables close together and as far away as possible from your pacemaker or defibrillator. Place the welding unit away from the work area.
  • Connect the ground clamp to the metal as close to the point of welding as possible. Arrange the work so the handle and rod will not contact the metal being welded if they are accidentally dropped.
  • Wait several seconds between attempts when having difficulty starting a weld.
  • Work in an area that offers firm footing and plenty of room for movement.
  • Work with an informed person who understands these suggestions.
  • Immediately stop welding and step away from the area if you start feeling light-headed, dizzy, or you believe your defibrillator has delivered a shock.
http://www.medtronic.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=Medtronic/Website/StageArticle&ConditionName=Tachyarrhythmia&Stage=Treatment&Article=heartmc_art_chainsaw_and_welders



http://files.aws.org/technical/facts/FACT-16.PDF
 
Last edited:

badger

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Tooele Utah It's 40 klicks south and west of SLC
Thank you guys. Not to worry about the "heart" pun bud......I thought it was kind of funny actually! And after reading that article from midnight....I think I'll learn how to a better job with gas welding! I **** sure dont need or want any palipitations! Besides, that sounds like a total pain in the rear, just to do a little welding. I'll make my boy do it......or just play with that gas some more, and get better.

At any rate, thanks for the info. And thanks Jim, for looking up that Medtronics stuff....mine is a Guidant, but they're one in the same just about. The only differance is the shape I think.

John
 

lehanover

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Old fasioned gas welding will do very nearly every job there is to do. Not far back all aircraft made of tubing were brazed. My mother gas welded aluminum tanks during WWII. Race cars from England were brazed together, including the rollover structures. I gas weld 4130 roll cages, and drape each weld with a ceramic blanket, to keep the welds from heat treating themselves. I have a 600 amp Hobart TIG, but only use it for aluminum.

If you can braze, you can gas weld. Take some lessons. You can build anything. Stay away from TIG machines. The high frequency (radio) feature is on any time the thing is turned on.

Lynn E. Hanover
 

badger

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Lynn,

Thank you bid. I've since decided to have a guy do it for me, WHICH I might ad, I'm still waiting on! About 6 weeks now. But, it's a free-be, so I aint gonna sqwak much....just bide my time and sooner or later...

I been doing a little more gas welding also....trying to weld links of chain together. A guy down at the feed store told me that welding those chain links together is a really good way to practice.

But thanks for your reply, indeed. I truely appreciate it.

John
 

badger

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Tooele Utah It's 40 klicks south and west of SLC
You betcha Ice. Where you want me to send it? I seen that picture about 5 years ago, and immediately adopted it. My dad's mom was a full blood Apache, so I figure I got bragging rights!

John





quote=AVI;33755]Badger:
That's one cool avatar!!
Can you send a larger image?[/quote]
 

Dana

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Here's another [gas] welding question: How important is the torch? I have one of those cheap welding sets from Harbor Freight, to which I've added 000 and 00 tips for thin work (it came with an 0 and a 2 tip but even the 2 tip won't handle much over 1/8" stock (which doesn't matter for aircraft work) and then you practically watch the tank pressure gages move with such small tanks... including a cutting torch is a joke but I digress). The torch is basically a Chinese Victor clone. I have no training and my welds (only on non critical things like PPG exhausts and light automotive stuff) often look ugly, but I haven't had one fail yet. I'd love to get to the point where I feel comfortable building a steel tube airframe (or even making repairs or mods on the one I now have), but I'm sure not there yet. A friend has a Dillon torch and swears by it but it's not in the budget right now.

-Dana

New safety announcement from the Department of Homeland Security: Securely duct tape shut any books you may own about civil liberties or the U.S. Constitution.
 

Mike Armstrong

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near San Diego
Here's another [gas] welding question: How important is the torch? I have one of those cheap welding sets from Harbor Freight, to which I've added 000 and 00 tips for thin work (it came with an 0 and a 2 tip but even the 2 tip won't handle much over 1/8" stock (which doesn't matter for aircraft work) and then you practically watch the tank pressure gages move with such small tanks... including a cutting torch is a joke but I digress). The torch is basically a Chinese Victor clone. I have no training and my welds (only on non critical things like PPG exhausts and light automotive stuff) often look ugly, but I haven't had one fail yet. I'd love to get to the point where I feel comfortable building a steel tube airframe (or even making repairs or mods on the one I now have), but I'm sure not there yet. A friend has a Dillon torch and swears by it but it's not in the budget right now.

-Dana

New safety announcement from the Department of Homeland Security: Securely duct tape shut any books you may own about civil liberties or the U.S. Constitution.

Hi Dana.

One of the best, most light weight Gas torches out there is the Meco Midgit Torch. Along with the super lightweight hoses Tinmantech also sells, it's a great combo especially for navigation your way around 4130 steel tube fuselages.

Meco Midget Torch: leadwork, soldering, silver, welds and welding


Mike
 

badger

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Dana,

Good question too. I used the smallest tip I could find, but still I kept burning holes in the tube. (4130 x .058). That link that Mike has....thats ther exactly one I've been looking for. Thats the same one that the guy on the EAA welding hint (help) videos uses! Looks a lot easier to maneuver around and stuff.

Thanks Mike, for the link. I'm gonna go check it out a bit more, and probably buy one.

jb
 

Mike Armstrong

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near San Diego
Dana,

Good question too. I used the smallest tip I could find, but still I kept burning holes in the tube. (4130 x .058). That link that Mike has....thats ther exactly one I've been looking for. Thats the same one that the guy on the EAA welding hint (help) videos uses! Looks a lot easier to maneuver around and stuff.

Thanks Mike, for the link. I'm gonna go check it out a bit more, and probably buy one.

jb

No problem, glad to contribute. Be sure and check their 4130 kits and video's too.

4130 Chrome-Molly Steel


Mike
 

lehanover

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The Dillon/Henrob is just a medium aircraft like handset, with a pistol grip and a shield to protect your hand from the heat of welding. It adds only novelty to the welding mission. There are some situations where this handset will help you reach inside of some structure, where a conventional handset might be too long. Otherwise, the cutting feature with its guide wheels is the feature of note. I saw a demonstration at a race track once that got me interested. The operator was highly skilled with this equipment and would cut your name out of a piece of 3/8” plate and gift it to you. The cuts were very clean. He cut strips of stock off of both plate and sheet stock at high cutting rates. So, if you need to manufacture shapes from plate stock, the Dillon/ Henrob (same thing) is the rig to own. I have it hooked up all of the time, just for the tight spaces feature. The shield thing went into the trash years ago. Mine was a gift from a friend who bought it and then didn't like it.


Gas welding up to about 1/8” is about the limit unless you can have help heating the weld area with a friend and another torch. Beyond 1/8” it is better to use TIG for critical stuff, or MIG for less critical stuff like trailer repair or manufacture. There are folks manufacturing 4130 tubing fuselages with MIG, but the skill required is impressive.


That Avitar of my last race car has a chassis of 1 5/8 .120 wall 4130 that was all gas welded with my Henrob. Three tube junctions needed help from another torch to get enough heat into the weld area.


Welding is like learning to ride a bike. You cannot pedal and steer at the same time. Then one day something clicks, and off you go. Your first good looking bead.


My mother welded aluminum oil tanks with blue goggles and gas during WWII. I was 24 before I put down a bead she approved of.


Have somebody who can weld show you how to do it. At the big airshows you can learn for free in the welding display tents.


Lynn E. Hanover
 

Dana

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The Dillon/Henrob is just a medium aircraft like handset, with a pistol grip and a shield to protect your hand from the heat of welding. It adds only novelty...
They claim some fancy mixing setup requiring lower pressure regulators... is this not the case? The Meco looks nice too though...

-Dana

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PTAirco

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Corona CA
I love my Henrob torch, though any torch will work as long as you use the right size tip. I bought some equipment from Harbor Freight and found it perfectly ok.

What I like about the Henrob is the soft quiet flame that can be adjusted over a much wider range than a normal tip, meaning you need fewer tip sizes. I mostly use the 0 and 1 sizes. they claim you can weld aluminium without flux and I have seen them do it. I am at the bottom of the learning curve for gas welding aluminium, whereas I used to be certified on steel.

I learned on material around 0.035 -0.049 and I have no difficulty with it - if you're learning aircraft welding it really does not help if you practice on chunky slabs of 1/8" steel.

Yes, it really is like learning to to ride a bike, one day you just get it.
 
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