No. That does NOT say really anything relevant at all in 2020. Just name calling.Seems to me that says it all.
Noted and acknowledged.Success built on past failures is the story of what America is all about. Viking's contribution to the E-AB community should be acknowledged and appreciated.
The story of the Viking engine is checkered. I know a number of people flying them NOW (latest iteration) who are happy with them and some who are not. I also know a number of people who bought the 110 engines and had nothing but miserable experiences with them as they were not developed and tested properly and again, as with the Subarus, customers were really Beta testers. The stated power clearly wasn't there as it was just a guess. Lots of things were not right and had to be updated (at customer expense), engines delivered without ECUs and then when they got those (1-2 years later!) they didn't start in cold weather (couldn't be mapped in warm Florida of course) and didn't run very well even then. He did something like 3 generations of ECU in quick succession to try to address major issues because they were hurried to market without enough flight time. We sold a number of SDS ECUs to customers who were waiting for their Viking ones or were disgusted when the engines didn't run right when they finally got them.Rik- said:
Just curious, why did no one recommend the viking (aka Honda) engines? Is it due to Jan's reputation
No. That does NOT say really anything relevant at all in 2020. Just name calling.
Nor does this kind of cheap shot speak to the Viking Honda conversion's success over the past decade. Time to let 20 year old stories go. If you want to bring up some recent story then tell the facts in full. AND then we should balance that with a fair number of positive stories.
There are dozens of recommendations via the Zenith Forum and dozens more on the Viking company forum.
For dozens more look here.
You don't sell hundreds of engines without making owners and builders happy.
Success built on past failures is the story of what America is all about. Viking's contribution to the E-AB community should be acknowledged and appreciated.
Agree and appreciate your thoughts....except the "For every guy you know ... I could counter..". This line is flawed simply because the sample size is just too small to make any such conclusion. That is why personality based comments are not appropriate. That is also why I referenced the Zenith forum where more than 7,000 members congregate. The Viking factory forum has another 1,800+. So with Viking now having more than ten years of operating with five full years selling hundreds of the 130HP model, it is certainly time to look at the current picture. I follow those forums closely. Also see here: Customers — Viking & Valkyrie PowerQuestion. Have you ever met Jan personally?
No personal slights in my comments, just facts and my opinion from actually knowing and working with the guy. I gave credit where it was due. I worked with him as the ECU supplier in the Subaru era for several years, tried to help him with his turbo development but he knew better and proceeded to blown up several engines because he actually didn't know better. I cut ties with Jan because of the way he was treating his customers and wanted no part or association with that mess. It cost us lots of sales but to me, a clear conscience and doing the right thing outweighs money every time.
The Viking 130 doesn't have even a fraction of the flight time of the Rotax 9 series (tens of millions of hours) and non-certified engines don't have to comply with ADs. So not sure why you mention that?
You're right, in 5 or 10 years we can have enough flight hours to gauge the reliability of the Viking line, until then, it's unknown. They could turn out to be really good- or not. My background is engine development (40 years) and I see lots of things were not done right in this program.
For every guy you know who likes the Viking engine and Jan, I could counter with one who's had a bad experience including the Zenith guy right at Edgewater who just phoned me a few weeks back. I ain't all roses.
Folks can buy any engine they want for their plane and clearly, lots are buying Vikings now. That's great for Jan and if the engines perform well and are reliable, that's great for his customers too. That good word will spread and will feed more business. However, lots of people who never saw product or their deposit money back won't forget how they were treated. History is important and I don't like to see it erased. If Jan is doing well now, maybe he could pay back some of the customers he owes money to but I'm pretty sure the Leopard can't change its spots...
People will decide on their own through independent feedback and research on what engine they will buy. A company which is transparent, owns up to problems, comes up with valid fixes to those problems (and pays for them) plus has good customer service would be the one that I would choose. My 2 cents.
How many customers need to be treated unfairly for you to draw a conclusion about a company’s business practices?This line is flawed simply because the sample size is just too small to make any such conclusion.