Modern day "motorcycle of the air" aircraft class?

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Victor Bravo

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Matthew, am I seeing things or are there little sailplane style winglets on that Stuka prototype???

I think that he cranked the wings for downward visibility, because it would have been terrible if those wings came straight out from the root.
 

cluttonfred

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Not winglets, though they could have led to their discovery a few decades earlier had the plane been adopted. ;-) They are little masts for the wire antennae strung between the wingtips and the rudder for the radio, see this drawing for a little more clarity.
 
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Aerowerx

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......but in a ride-on style where the bent tubes form the backrest/rollbar for attaching a seat harness and maybe the cabane for the upper wing but the pilot stills straddles the single tubes that form the main fuselage truss.
You mean like the single bent tube idea that was kicking around here last year?
 

cluttonfred

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No, just a truss with a limited number of members and using doubled tubes in certain places such as the backrest/rollover structure.
 

saini flyer

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Very Nice!
It violates my sworn oath of "simplicity at all cost" but for that one I'd make an exception. MORE PICTURES!
DSC00023.jpgIMG_0001.jpgIMG_9999.jpg

Wow! I did not know that you guys haven't seen this. I have more pictures and will post them....
BTW, anyone wants to guess the name and the builder?
Most if not all of you know the builder :cool:
 

FritzW

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I did not know that you guys haven't seen this.
I've seen the renderings here on the HBA before but not the actual project.
Life's too short for guessing games, what's the story on this thing? It looks like it would be a blast to fly. It seems like the ground handling would be fine. How are the controls laid out?
 

saini flyer

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I've seen the renderings here on the HBA before but not the actual project.
Life's too short for guessing games, what's the story on this thing? It looks like it would be a blast to fly. It seems like the ground handling would be fine. How are the controls laid out?
Fritz, you are scaring us old folks with "life is too short", specially with current events :eek::oops:
I will spill the beans.....
This is the "motorcycle dragon" from Brian Carpenter. He was working on it way before the EMG projects. I have a bunch of pictures that he shared long back. Here are some more:
045.jpg045.jpg048.jpg089.jpg090.jpg093.jpg094.jpg199.jpgcycle assembly3.jpgIMG_0012.jpgIMG_0013.jpg
 

Victor Bravo

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Boy he sure likes to weld.... my hat's off to him.

I believe he would have more success with selling kits for this than the EMG glider. At least there is a clear niche for this where it would do something specific a lot better than other airplanes. Complexity aside, it totally meets the mission for what this thread is all about.
 

Megan May

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Fritz, you are scaring us old folks with "life is too short", specially with current events :eek::oops:
I will spill the beans.....
This is the "motorcycle dragon" from Brian Carpenter. He was working on it way before the EMG projects. I have a bunch of pictures that he shared long back. Here are some more:
View attachment 94791View attachment 94791View attachment 94792View attachment 94793View attachment 94794View attachment 94795View attachment 94796View attachment 94797View attachment 94798View attachment 94799View attachment 94800
As a self-professed Ducatista, I love the frame! Though that's waaaaay too much welding for what I have in mind. 😅 Still, the overall configuration of this flying machine is very interesting to me. Thinking of making my own version, it would need to be boiled down to the very simplest size, shape (e.g. constant-chord wings), construction, etc.

So let me ask you all, what wing-construction method would meet the following criteria the best:
1. Appeal in the "Hey, I could build THAT!" department
2. Weight (I'm still thinking 103 at this point)
3. Speed of completion
4. Cost
 

Megan May

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BTW: I don't want to step on anyone's toes. VB, the Ranger you mentioned, that's FritzW's IP, as you mentioned, right? FritzW, are you also designing and building a MOTA? If not, I think Megan's MOTA has a certain alliterated ring to it. 😅
 

Victor Bravo

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Well, like I said, there were three or four discussions that had ideas flying around from several people. MOTA, Affordaplane replacement, 21st C Volksplane, and other threads. One of the more promising Affordaplane and Airbike style ideas was refined quite a bit, some of the better ideas emerged, and it started to move out of the arm-waving and tinfoil hat stage into the "this could actually happen" stage. It was split off from the previous threads into its own stand-alone idea. Fritz had been doing the vast majority of the refining and rendering on it, and as the de facto project lead he picked the name for it, and it took on a life of its own. Then he started actually cutting and assembling some test components, forward fuselage section, etc. and it hatched into something that was real. Kind of like the guy in that great video for the song "Take on me" by A-HA, where he goes from a cartoon into a real person :)

So yeah, as much as anything discussed on the internet can be attributed to someone, it's his IP.
 

FritzW

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FritzW, are you also designing and building a MOTA?
I'm building two "one offs" and fixing a kit built. The Neirrh is on hold until the Ranger is finished and the Ranger is on hold until the Waiex is fixed and the Waiex is on hold until the Great Toilet Paper Panic of 2020 is over.


So let me ask you all, what wing-construction method would meet the following criteria the best:
1. Appeal in the "Hey, I could build THAT!" department
2. Weight (I'm still thinking 103 at this point)
3. Speed of completion
4. Cost
THIS one comes close but you need a CNC machine (or access to one).
 

Megan May

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I'm building two "one offs" and fixing a kit built. The Neirrh is on hold until the Ranger is finished and the Ranger is on hold until the Waiex is fixed and the Waiex is on hold until the Great Toilet Paper Panic of 2020 is over.




THIS one comes close but you need a CNC machine (or access to one).
I read through the lightweight wing thread of yours. Incredible. I'm a big fan of the jig-less tab A in slot A method of assembly. I would love to be able to offer people a package of all the ribs, spar webs, spar caps, rib caps, etc. Maybe even preformed LEs? With those scallops of yours, gorgeous.
 

Megan May

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I'm building two "one offs" and fixing a kit built. The Neirrh is on hold until the Ranger is finished and the Ranger is on hold until the Waiex is fixed and the Waiex is on hold until the Great Toilet Paper Panic of 2020 is over.




THIS one comes close but you need a CNC machine (or access to one).
My other company, we have a lot of things CNC laser-cut. We could just have one of our laser-cutters make the various parts for us--once it's out of the prototype stage and into production. I wonder how much heavier an aluminum wing using that same method would weigh? Everything could be laser-cut or CNC punch. No rib forming. Just line it all up, maybe cleco things here and there, and pop-rivet.
 

Victor Bravo

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I think the wood wing he designed takes advantage of the thickness of the wood... if you substituted flat thin sheet metal for the rib diagonals and caps they would not be stiff enough. You could make little bent angles out of all those thin metal pieces but the ribs would take a lot more time to build. At that point, you would be faster and perhaps better off using the Kolb wing rib, which is a riveted truss made out of small diameter tube. The ribs are one of the clever things about the Kolb I was mentioning on another thread.
 
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