Low power - two seats - LSA -- sugestions?

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antoniv

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Jun 21, 2006
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I'm thinking about my new construction project. Being realistic and somewhat optimistic we can have a new project finished in a margin of 6 to 8 years.

I have doubts that it will happen in a margin of 10 years with combustion engines and fossil fuels. I don't think they will disappear, but we are going to have a much more difficult time using them.

For this reason I propose a new construction with these three basic premises for an aircraft in the European LSA category:

High efficiency - low power +- 50 hp
Two seats
Safe flight at low speeds

I ask for your suggestions:

Here mine:

Michael Barry Sourisce Bulle
KR2 with motorsailer wings
Piuma Project

tank's
 

sming

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Apr 10, 2019
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You are juste spelling 'Gaz'Aile' with your requirements 😄
And with diesel being now the devil, millions of PSA engines are/will be available from the cars wrecks. It's a pretty safe bet that Jet A won't be banned for the next 20 years, if ever.
 

antoniv

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Jun 21, 2006
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Thanks for the answers, some clarifications:

CLARIFICATION 1

The option for high efficiency, clean and green is a personal option and has nothing to do with politics.

Throughout our lives we change our preferences. For me, the years when I loved the taste of gasoline and the noise of a 2T engine have passed.
I spent many years flying a deltatrike with a Rotax 503 engine on my back. Now I hate that noise.

CLARIFICATION 2

When I refer to a European LSA, this encompasses any hombuilder aircraft - two-seater - with a maximum takeoff weight of 550 kg (1200 lb). This does not mean that you should reach the maximum weight. I really like ultralights.
 

antoniv

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Jun 21, 2006
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Personally though I would not consider LSA, there are less restrictions especially electric with powered glider.

From 2015, SkiGull details revealed (a glider)
Yeeeees, you hit the nail on the head.

Mr. Rutan is a genius and I have always wished I could build one of his canards but they are too fast for me.

I agree with mr Rutan that the most effective configuration is that of a motorsailer.

I think aloud:

A pusher configuration, tandem seats with sailboat-type wings? Something like a two-seat Janowski J1?
 

nestofdragons

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John.Roo

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Letohrad / Czech Republic
Thanks for the answers, some clarifications:

CLARIFICATION 1

The option for high efficiency, clean and green is a personal option and has nothing to do with politics.

Throughout our lives we change our preferences. For me, the years when I loved the taste of gasoline and the noise of a 2T engine have passed.
I spent many years flying a deltatrike with a Rotax 503 engine on my back. Now I hate that noise.

CLARIFICATION 2

When I refer to a European LSA, this encompasses any hombuilder aircraft - two-seater - with a maximum takeoff weight of 550 kg (1200 lb). This does not mean that you should reach the maximum weight. I really like ultralights.
Hello!
Just to understand well....
1) Are you planning to make just one airplane for yourself?
2) Why MTOM 550 kg? In most of EU is limit (or planned limit) for MTOM 600 kg.
Doesn´t look like large difference, but is important in case you think about electric propulsion in future.
3) What material do you prefere? Composite, wood, metal...? Piuma and KR2 looks like wooden contructions.

Best regards!
Martin

P.S.
I forgot to ask.... what is your pilot experince? Gliders, UL, PPL....
 

antoniv

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Jun 21, 2006
Messages
30
I propose Mignet HM380. It needs a bit stronger engine, but ... flies super at lower speeds.

Plans are free to download at flying flea - Nest of Dragons

some reading about the airplane:
Mignet HM.380 Flying Flea- 1998 - Lane Motor Museum
If you install a split Cousandy flap it has full 3 axis steering, which you think to need at crosswinds. But it flies super without too.
Jejeje

You have touched on a sensitive topic. The Mignet formula has also tempted me for a long time.

An HM361 with tandem seating configuration?

Like a Crosses Airplume?
 

antoniv

Active Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2006
Messages
30
Hello!
Just to understand well....
1) Are you planning to make just one airplane for yourself?
2) Why MTOM 550 kg? In most of EU is limit (or planned limit) for MTOM 600 kg.
Doesn´t look like large difference, but is important in case you think about electric propulsion in future.
3) What material do you prefere? Composite, wood, metal...? Piuma and KR2 looks like wooden contructions.

Best regards!
Martin

P.S.
I forgot to ask.... what is your pilot experince? Gliders, UL, PPL....
I'm thinking about my next hombuilder project for the hard way of scratch building

I have extensive work experience in composite materials and aeronautical wood construction (HiMax - Pionner 200 - Atec Zephyr).

So I prefer the wood-composite system, but I have no problem with a steel tube fuselage. I discard aluminum sheet for now.

My flight experience is in 3rt generation ULM (450 kg).

Weight limit 550 - 600 kg but always in the lowest part of the range,
 

nestofdragons

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Near Antwerp, Belgium
Jejeje

You have touched on a sensitive topic. The Mignet formula has also tempted me for a long time.

An HM361 with tandem seating configuration?

Like a Crosses Airplume?
If going for something like Airplume, be sure to make the fuselage really really torsion rigid. Croses had to reinforce their fuselages. Flying Flea have a torsion you better not underestimate. I am not sure if you have the plans for a HM361. I guess i only saw rough plans of the fuselage. But if you want side by side your choice is much larger for plans. Mignet or Croses. By the way ... Croses has revived their plan selling after the death of old age of Mr. Emile Croses. If you cannot find the website, i will guide.
 

nestofdragons

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Antoniv, are you from Russia? If yes, there is a real Flying Flea revival going on in Russia. A few projects already flying. Several constructions have started.
 

blane.c

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capital district NY

You may like this as well.
 

nestofdragons

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Jun 8, 2016
Messages
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Location
Near Antwerp, Belgium
If you consider designing a tandemwing yourself, also take this one in count. The work of Maurice Delanne. It has a non-rotating front wing. In design you will have to experiment yourself with the needed AoA of the wings to get it right. But ... it might be a fun project.
Be sure to look at the other Delanne pages using the links right at top.
Maurice Delanne (Duo-Mono) - Nest of Dragons
delanne_fourseater_500x479.jpg
 
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