# Airplane For SaleHummel Ultracruiser

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#### skyking

Recently completed Hummel Ultracruiser from kit (450 build hours) with following add-ons: Canopy, Throttle, Cabin Heat, Spinner. 45hp Scott Casler 1/2 VW Engine - hand prop, dual ignition. Prince 54x28 Carbon FIber E-Tip Prop. One hour on Hobbs for engine run-up and initial test flight. UMA Analog Airspeed, AvMap EFIS, MGL Digital Oil Temp/Pressure/Volts, Flight Data Systems T-30 Tach , Garmin GPS 396 in panel. External Antenna with coax and control stick PTT for handheld hookup. LiFePo 16aH battery with charger for panel and secondary ignition. Seat Cushions. Black Max brakes with dual master cylinder for differential braking. Red-white-blue patriotic vinyl wrap. Additional pics and info available on request. Fits on 12 ft flatbed trailer or modified boat trailer, wings fit in bed of pickup. Selling for cost of parts at $25,000. Located in central NH. #### Bigshu ##### Well-Known Member Recently completed Hummel Ultracruiser from kit (450 build hours) with following add-ons: Canopy, Throttle, Cabin Heat, Spinner. 45hp Scott Casler 1/2 VW Engine - hand prop, dual ignition. Prince 54x28 Carbon FIber E-Tip Prop. One hour on Hobbs for engine run-up and initial test flight. UMA Analog Airspeed, AvMap EFIS, MGL Digital Oil Temp/Pressure/Volts, Flight Data Systems T-30 Tach , Garmin GPS 396 in panel. External Antenna with coax and control stick PTT for handheld hookup. LiFePo 16aH battery with charger for panel and secondary ignition. Seat Cushions. Black Max brakes with dual master cylinder for differential braking. Red-white-blue patriotic vinyl wrap. Additional pics and info available on request. Fits on 12 ft flatbed trailer or modified boat trailer, wings fit in bed of pickup. Selling for cost of parts at$25,000. Located in central NH.

View attachment 114096
Nice looking build, but what's the weight? Full build log, visits from EAA tech advisor?

#### Victor Bravo

##### Well-Known Member
The cost of parts, the cost of construction, or what someone previously paid for it (a car, an airplane, a computer, a cell phone) has precisely zero effect on the market value or the value to a potential buyer five minutes later.

#### 12notes

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
Yep...pricey! If he holds out long enough, there may be someone that'll bite on it. For anything Hummel, I'd be looking at something in the <= $8,000 range. But nice bird just the same. You'd be hard pressed to find any flying Hummels that cheap. The guy who wanted to pay$8,000 for a flying Ultracruiser was basically laughed at on the Hummel group. $8,000 is the "needs a little work" price for an Ultracruiser. The cheapest I've seen one in the last year has been$10,000 for a quick sale, but that was abnormally low. A used one with a new engine sold for $18K a few months back. You can build from plans, but a full kit for one is$16K, without the engine & instruments.

Hummelbirds don't come up for sale very often, and there's some that are 30+ years old now, so there can be a big price difference between a flying one and a "technically still flyable" one. Must be built from plans, they sell some parts, but there isn't a full kit available. An ok looking one (not a lot of hours, not bad looking, but not spectacular) went for $12K about 4 years ago. There haven't been that many H5's built, but the last one I know about sold for well over$15K. You can build from plans, but a full kit is $20K plus engine and instruments.$25K is probably 30-40% too high, so, while really optimistic, not quite into the crazy category. That could easily be the cost of parts alone, so I don't blame the guy for trying to get his money out of it, even though that's not realistic for most homebuilts that don't start with "Vans".

#### skyking

Not going to get into a pi$$ing contest with anyone here, but facts are facts: Cost of parts purchased last Oct-Dec: Kit + add-ons: 17,375 Engine: 5490 Prop: 830 Panel: 1578 Misc Parts: 2195 (1000 Vinyl Wrap, 650 Brakes, etc) Total: 27,468 With recent price increases, same parts are now 28,786 There is a 9-10 month wait for engine and prop Build time 200-400 hrs depending on how handy you are You are all entitled to your 'opinions' but after the all the price trashing I will never be able to sell this here - thanks, guys. My bad - should have known better to post an ad on a discussion forum with all the 'experts' and their opinions just waiting to jump on anything that doesn't conform to their view of reality. Over and out. #### 12notes ##### Well-Known Member Log Member Not going to get into a pi$$ing contest with anyone here, but facts are facts:

Cost of parts purchased last Oct-Dec:

Kit + add-ons: $17,375 Engine:$5490
Prop: $830 Panel:$1578
Misc Parts: $2195 ($1000 Vinyl Wrap, $650 Brakes, etc) Total:$27,468

With recent price increases, same parts are now $28,786 There is a 9-10 month wait for engine and prop Build time 200-400 hrs depending on how handy you are You are all entitled to your 'opinions' but after the all the price trashing I will never be able to sell this here - thanks, guys. My bad - should have known better to post an ad on a discussion forum with all the 'experts' and their opinions just waiting to jump on anything that doesn't conform to their view of reality. Over and out. Reality is that homebuilts typically do not sell for the cost it took to build them. It's unfortunate, but is a fact with thousands of data points behind it. There are exceptions, most notably Vans aircraft, but Hummels are not one of them. Good luck on your sale, but prepare to be disappointed. You can try asking about it on the Hummel Facebook group, who know more about what your aircraft is worth than anyone else, but they will also know that without an N-number, it's definitely overweight for part 103 if it just had the vinyl wrap, let alone the canopy. Your best option is to post on Barnstormers and hope someone bites. #### Topaz ##### Super Moderator Staff member Log Member Not going to get into a pi$$ing contest with anyone here, but facts are facts: ... Nobody is questioning what the airplane cost you. The fact remains that the likely sell-price of a kitplane is often less than the sum of its parts. That's an unfortunate fact of life. The questions about the airplane's empty weight are entirely relevant to the discussion, and any likely buyer is going to ask those same questions. Might as well get them answered and out of the way up-front. All that said, you have a point about the dog-piling that happened here. Guys, come on. Let's be gentle with new members. Help him get to where he wants to go. If it's selling this airplane, constructive criticism goes a lot further than what we did here. Let's be better. #### Victor Bravo ##### Well-Known Member OK, I will gladly apologize to the OP if the group (or the moderators) think it is appropriate, but I must also defend my own position just a little. Perhaps it's just to clear my name to my friends here, or perhaps it's an aviation integrity thing, or perhaps I'm accidentally being the bad guy and just won't admit it. Y'all can decide. A guy posts something for sale at a price that 90% of the E-AB participants would find inappropriate, unrealistic, or perhaps even just a little offensive. He makes no apology for posting something that is way off base to the majority of people. The (apparent) means of justification for his (slightly offensive) price - his cost - is universally agreed to be irrelevant in every marketplace in the world, from the stock market to the swap meet. He does not remotely address the obvious "Catch-22" question (interplay between weight, equipment installed, and E-AB N number) and apparently does not care that this would be an obvious thing to people who have been around airplanes for a week or two. Then, when one or more people raise questions (or eyebrows) about these things, the OP becomes offended, and the person(s) who raised these obvious questions is immediately positioned as being intolerant of his views. SkyKing, I 100% apologize for offending you if it was my comment that did so. How do you feel about posting something that may have seemed arrogant, or something that suspiciously sidestepped the obvious questions that experienced aviation people would react to? #### Dana ##### Super Moderator Staff member Let's play nice, guys. An airplane is worth what a buyer will pay for it, no more, no less. If the asking price is too high it won't sell. If it's really too high the seller won't even get any calls. #### Turd Ferguson ##### Well-Known Member Plain ol' Cessna 150's are popping up in the various classified ads at 1.5 times what they were being advertised for 18 months ago. Optimistic sellers? Speculation about a rule change? C'mon man, '66 F models for$35k?

Nothing surprises me anymore

#### skyking

##### Member
UPDATE: Since I can't edit OP, this is to inform everyone that the Ultracruiser SOLD for the build/asking price of \$25k. Buyer is a Glasair driver who didn't question the weight or price based on his mission and what he wanted it for.

And to Victor Bravo, your opinion on my post is just that - an opinion. Lucky for me the buyer was in the 10% of people who didn't find my post "inappropriate, unrealistic, or perhaps even just a little offensive", huh?

Over and Out

#### jedi

##### Well-Known Member
Sky King;

Thanks for the update. Now, for the record, can you tell us the real empty weight?

Do you have a suggestion for how the new owner should approach the FAA?

Does he appear to know what he bought or did he buy a pig in a poke?

If he is a Glasair owner he should be informed so I will not loose any sleep over it. I am just curious so as to know what goes on out there. Just this week I had a long discussion with the local FSDO on this and other similar issues. We have our disagreements. My questions are "above his pay grade". He just needs to put the check in the legal box and wants to ignore how they got there. I have several ways to accomplish that but am always looking for more information. So those are my reason for asking and I would appreciate any and all comments from the OP or other esteemed HBA members up to and including VB.

I am looking forward to your reply.

#### Victor Bravo

##### Well-Known Member
Congratulations on your sale. Tell me which points I made in any of my posts, or opinions that I shared, that you see fault with.

This is admittedly esoteric, but perhaps you can do an informal poll by asking the membership here what they think about if, who, and what was likely to be offensive to a majority of people in the experimental aviation world.

My opinion also "didn't conform to your view of reality", you were spring-loaded, and made some pointed remarks about it. Can you explain how's that different than the intolerance that you felt I was showing you?