Discussion in 'Workshop Tips and Secrets / Tools' started by proppastie, Nov 3, 2017.

1. Nov 3, 2017

### proppastie

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With the 3M organic mask I was still getting head-aches with the solvents in the Poly Fiber. I decided I needed a Fresh Air Mask or Supplied Air Mask. Not wanting to spend the $300-$500 these items normally go for .....off to E-Bay.

I purchased a system that uses a compressor shown in the first picture. It uses the 3M mask and was about $40. After I got it I drained my vintage compressor and decided that what came out of the tank was too vile to breathe, so I borrowed a "oil-less" Horror Freight compressor. That did not work, could not supply enough air, probably good for inflating tires but that is about it. Somebody gave me some pool vacuum hose and I found a 12v car vacuum never used in the basement and somebody gave me a hose from a CPAP mask. I used an old Northern Mask that has a male thread, and it worked great. Painted my Seat Back and no fumes or headache. Last edited: Nov 3, 2017 jmt1991 and Joe Fisher like this. 2. Nov 3, 2017 ### Kyle Boatright ### Kyle Boatright #### Well-Known Member Joined: Nov 12, 2012 Messages: 780 Likes Received: 412 Location: Marietta, GA I made a similar one years ago from a bathroom vent fan, a chemical face shield from Harbor freight, duct tape, and the hood section from a poncho. Plus the same pool cleaner corrugated hose you used. Worked well and remains on a shelf in the shop should I ever need it again. Tear-off covers for the face shield kept it from becoming covered with overspray. 3. Nov 4, 2017 ### narfi ### narfi #### Well-Known Member Joined: Feb 23, 2016 Messages: 721 Likes Received: 354 Location: Alaska I really enjoy a full face mask with forced air when using nasty chemicals and painting. Your eyes are mucus membranes that can absorb those nasty chemicals into your body faster than your skin....... proppastie and BoKu like this. 4. Nov 4, 2017 ### proppastie ### proppastie #### Well-Known Member Joined: Feb 19, 2012 Messages: 3,718 Likes Received: 1,080 Location: NJ I had been doing the stuff on the porch with the rags and MEK for the brush behind me and the work in front of me. I then transitioned to 100 ft. out in the field and up wind of the work along with the Fresh Air Mask. I did not notice any problems with the eyes, but an added benefit of the mask was that the air exiting the mask also flooded the air around my face/eyes with air so maybe that was why I did not have any problems. Also long sleeves and latex gloves. 5. Jan 31, 2018 ### pictsidhe ### pictsidhe #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jul 15, 2014 Messages: 6,742 Likes Received: 1,779 Location: North Carolina suck/blow vacuum cleaner. plastic bag with the end folded and taped to take a drawstring round my neck. mess of tape holding the hose in. That was for an unbelievably dirty job, vision was a bit impaired by the cheap bag. The dirt wiped off easily, though. I was having to stop often anyway as the air was too thick to see through... Bag was wimpy enough for me to tear the front out in case of a malfunction. Stuff was dropping on me, so i didn't want a really thin one. I'd do it again, if I wanted an unimpaired view, some clear film taped into a hole in the bag might be good, or see if I could just vent a motorcycle helmet. Special tools don't have to cost anything! 6. Jan 31, 2018 ### proppastie ### proppastie #### Well-Known Member Joined: Feb 19, 2012 Messages: 3,718 Likes Received: 1,080 Location: NJ my car vacuum had not been used, I think they are$15-20....I removed the bucket and was drawing the air from the outside ...used only 1/2 the unit if that makes sense. The picture shows only the top of the vacuum. The last 3 pictures are of the successful unit, the first 2 pictures are failures. Post 1

7. Oct 22, 2018

### lr27

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This thread was just referred to from a thread about epoxy. I once made a serviceable CPAP out of several 45 mm computer fans in series, with a bit of space in between. Even one of them would probably be enough to feed a mask through quite a few feet of hose. The type I used had two sets of blades in each unit, rotating in opposite directions. These are capable of more pressure than most computer fans. Something like this: http://www.delta-fan.com/Download/Spec/GFB0412GHS-CF00.pdf There's a picture at the end. Also note the graph on page 4, showing how the pressure is relatively constant over a wide range of flow. This is nice to have. Anyway, you can find older versions of these fans on eBay, cheep. New, they're $25 or$30 from Digikey. I needed 4 of them for the CPAP. I got the CPAP debugged very shortly before the wheels of bureaucracy had finally turned enough to supply me with a commercial one. The commercial ones are better, but mine worked ok.

Hint: Keep the mice out of your air supply. Not sure I'll ever use mine again. They nested in the sound absorbing material I was using. Also, make sure you can back away from the work and rip the mask off in a hurry if something catches fire and you get a face full of smoke. That means, don't work in tunnels full of toxic gas! This seems VERY unlikely, but chances are something in your setup will be flammable, and, if there are any, the flames WILL be fanned. Maybe I'm too paranoid. Worked in the medical device world for a while, where we had to watch out for flammability in materials.

8. Oct 22, 2018

### proppastie

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Just saw the exact 12V vacuum (car vacuum) in CVS for $15......I tried a CPAP mask, and it did not work, and I can not remember why?...I think someone still makes the external male thread dust masks......dust cartage female thread. 9. Oct 22, 2018 ### Pops ### Pops #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 1, 2013 Messages: 7,023 Likes Received: 5,920 Location: USA. I bought a HVLP Turbine spray outfit many years ago. Its a 9" turbine that will supply 2 spray guns and 2 hoods. I love it. When I paint, I never get a smell of any of the fumes. When the spray gun is adjusted correctly there is almost no over spray. I need to order a new hood, I think its a Wilson hood. The old one has seen its better days. Painting the white Poly-Fiber on the JMR flaps and ailerons tomorrow. Fresh air hood is a must. Picture is when I was painting the JMR fuselage. #### Attached Files: • ###### DSCF0042.jpg File size: 56.4 KB Views: 35 10. Oct 23, 2018 ### pictsidhe ### pictsidhe #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jul 15, 2014 Messages: 6,742 Likes Received: 1,779 Location: North Carolina A cheap electric airbed inflation pump might be worth trying. 11. Oct 23, 2018 ### Kyle Boatright ### Kyle Boatright #### Well-Known Member Joined: Nov 12, 2012 Messages: 780 Likes Received: 412 Location: Marietta, GA Bathroom fan. Costs$20, supplies plenty of CFM, and runs on 120V.

12. Oct 23, 2018

### Pops

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Whatever you can make to work, you have to have clean fresh air. A local retired airline pilot bought my buddies Jr Ace project and died 2 days after painting the Ace from the fumes of the paint. What ever you buy for the fresh air will be some of the best money spent.
Bathroom fan sounds like it would work, low pressure and higher volume. Make a sheet metal or plywood box and make a filter for the inlet air.

13. Oct 23, 2018

### Kyle Boatright

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I don't know that you need a filter. Just set it somewhere where it'll be sucking clean air.

14. Oct 23, 2018

### lr27

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CPAP Mark 1 used one of those. It would probably work.

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The longer your hose, the more back pressure. I wonder if a bathroom fan wouldn't need a bigger hose. For CPAP Mark 1, I used a corrugated hose intended for pumping out your basement with. Above a certain air velocity, it would kind of whistle, but I guess that wouldn't be a big problem for someone who wasn't trying to rest. A 72 cubic foot scuba tank, as I recall, is good for a long time at or near surface pressure. Two or three hours, I think. So if your mask didn't leak horribly, I imagine you could get by easily on several times that. The fan probably needs to go faster than you can inhale, but running all the time unless you have something fancy set up.

15. Oct 23, 2018

### Kyle Boatright

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I used about 25' of corrugated 1.5" (?) pool cleaner hose. It provided a wash of air under my homemade hood. I'm telling you, it worked really well.

16. Oct 23, 2018

### proppastie

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nice thing about the vacuum cleaner motor is that it comes with hose, hook-ups ,...you will not have to make an enclosure/case like for a bathroom or computer fan. If you need 110V then buy a cheap house vacuum...... But you might want a new one so as not to be initially sucking dirt from your living room. The little 12V vacuum I had about 50 ft of pool hose, with no problems supplying plenty of air to the mask and flood out from the exit valve up to protect my eyes. It should certainly work with a hood I would think but I have not tried that.

17. Oct 24, 2018

### jmt1991

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18. Oct 24, 2018

### proppastie

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19. Oct 25, 2018

### wmax351

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I've used a legit CNBr (chemical nuclear biological rated) PAPR when I was doing some interior car bodywork after high school, which had me inside the car with fumes. I didn't smell them at all until I went inside the house and took off the hood.

But for the rest of the people that don't have one of those lying around from when your dad's hospital had one flown in for a SARS rule out...

The basic device is a battery operated centrifugal fan that pulls air through a set of filters. Doesn't even need all that much air. You can test for breach by using a noxious substance. For critical stuff (like level 4 biohazards, smallpox, etc) you actually go through a room with some tear gas. But any highly smelly material will work.

The hood for the home version may be best obtained by getting a disposable one. They go through dozens when a patient has TB etc, so they shouldn't be too expensive. Also take a look on surplus sites.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ONE-3M-BE-10-Tychem-White-Respirator-Hood-Size-Large/163333404752

You can also get a real one (sans filters) for not that much money. Battery is easily jury rigged with anothe power supply or cordless tool battery. https://www.ebay.com/itm/3M-BREATHE...PR-RESPIRATOR-no-battery-filters/272590139199

These type of things are like airplanes. The certified stuff costs lots, and a lot expires, so is much cheaper when you buy it expired or undocumented, for a less critical job (still needs to work, but if you smell fumes, you stop, and you don't get anthrax).

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20. Oct 26, 2018

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