Flying wing as cheap and simple option for basic fun flying.

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Aesquire

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Jul 28, 2014
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Rochester, NY, USA
Pt2
Last 2 years I've been learning Kite boarding kites, and looking again at paragliding & PPG state of the art.

Since local winds are often too light for ridge soaring I'm considering a reflexed PPG wing at the largest size for weight range for foot launched free flight and near the middle for a light power trike.

Object is lowest available sink rate and airspeed for light days, & best climb & shortest take off under power for back yard use. Opinion?
 

addaon

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Feb 24, 2008
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2,342
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Kanab, UT
Learn to paraglide, unpowered, first. You'll be a better pilot for it. Learning under power, you can never get the same feel for the wing that you will unpowered; and getting those instincts in place is key. Higher wing loadings under power make collapse less likely, but also make it start to matter more -- getting to the point that pitch control is instinctual for minimizing collapses is worth every lesson.

Once you do that... you may find you don't want a reflexed wing for powered flight. They have a place, but the performance cost isn't great, and a competent (not to say great) pilot will often prefer to fly a standard wing, even under power.
 

Tiger Tim

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Apr 26, 2013
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Thunder Bay
For the second Lay-out it would still be a sit on top bird and a tractor engine and a single fin and the same wing dimensions but with a pod below the wing wich would make the balancing of various pilots weights easier.

But in this configuration I’d go for a 3 piece strutted wing, with detachable outer wing panels which would have the controls included (Elevons).
View attachment 129283

The highwing layout would be a perfect test bed for electric flight as well.
That layout has precedent, have you seen the Stabiloplan?
1661785202627.jpeg

Looks like a sort of giant, truncated Sky Pup. Seems like it would be worthwhile to build a model to feel out its general handling qualities.
 

Tiger Tim

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Thunder Bay
NO, that is very clearly a giant, truncated Lazy Bee!
Oh wow, how did I not see that?

In any case, to appease the two-axis plank crowds I wonder if something like it could have a wing akin to one of the larger Flying Fleas with the folding throw-over tips and no control surfaces on the outer panels. Go with the equivalent of a Cossandey flap on the center section for an elevator. Fuselage is just a mostly plywood box dangling below the wing and simple Flea-style gear consisting of an axle just shoved through the lower fuselage and bungeed in place. Maybe a little V-twin for power. Definitely a ballistic chute because I don’t fully trust the contraption I just described.
 

Fred C

Active Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2022
Messages
28
Pt2
Last 2 years I've been learning Kite boarding kites, and looking again at paragliding & PPG state of the art.

Since local winds are often too light for ridge soaring I'm considering a reflexed PPG wing at the largest size for weight range for foot launched free flight and near the middle for a light power trike.

Object is lowest available sink rate and airspeed for light days, & best climb & shortest take off under power for back yard use. Opinion?
See Tucker Gott, you tube. Sells wings, gives good advice.
 

Bille Floyd

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Joined
Sep 26, 2019
Messages
817
Pt2
Last 2 years I've been learning Kite boarding kites, and looking again at paragliding & PPG state of the art.

Since local winds are often too light for ridge soaring I'm considering a reflexed PPG wing at the largest size for weight range for foot launched free flight and near the middle for a light power trike.

Object is lowest available sink rate and airspeed for light days, & best climb & shortest take off under power for back yard use. Opinion?

I will optOut for advise on PG ; the kiteboarding thing is :
Really Fun , and reasonably safe ! You can die in that sport
though ; like all sports that are dependent on weather , ya
(got to stay focused) !!!

BilleBille kiteboarding .jpg
 
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Sockmonkey

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Apr 24, 2014
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2,348
Location
Flint, Mi, USA
There are several pepole here on HBA who have the engineering training to say I'm wrong, but... if you took the weight of the struts (fifteen or twenty or even thirty pounds) and correctly added that much weight to the spars, I beieve that (in the size and thickness range of most E-AB wings) you would wind up with an equally strong cantilever wing... with lower parts count, less to build, less drag, and likely less cost.

Very thin wings will benefit less from this, and thick wings would benefit more.

A kingpost and cable bracing will weigh a lot less, but I am limiting this comparison as being between a cantilever wing and steel or aluminum tube struts.

You will have a hard time convincing me that a strut braced Debreyer Pelican will have any advantage over a cantilever Pelican.
There is an additional structural advantage to struts. The connection point of the wings to the fuselage doesn't have to bear all the forces. For example, the longitudinal torque when the ailerons are used, or landing where the wheels hit the ground slightly unevenly. In a high wing, it's also acting as a triangular brace for the fuselage.
 

Tiger Tim

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Nice view of the MW9 Plank.
Must be especially nice to see pics of your own design in flight.

Curious what led to the nose being that shape whether it was a matter of structural simplicity, materials use, minimizing side area, or some other thing?
 

Mike W

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Nov 3, 2012
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103
Location
Doncaster Yorkshire UK
Must be especially nice to see pics of your own design in flight.

Curious what led to the nose being that shape whether it was a matter of structural simplicity, materials use, minimizing side area, or some other thing?
I hoped to fit a Cri Cri canopy but couldn't find one. Hence a bit Cri Cri about the nose. See YouTube.

Mike Whittaker's MW9 Plank On-board video​

 
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Riggerrob

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Sep 9, 2014
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Canada
That MW-9 canopy looks like a simplified version of the Cri-Cri. It combines the minimal profile with the simplicity of a flat-wrapped Cassut canopy. No need for fancy, blown, double curvature in the top of the canopy, where few pilots look anyways. The reviewing pilot admits to being taller than the designed M.W. He probably also strapped his GoPro camera to his forehead, so again, above the line of sight of most sport pilots.
MW-9 is all that the average sport pilot needs in his quest for hundred dollar hamburgers.
With a clever folding scheme, you might even fit an MW-9 into an ISO 20 shipping container.

How many horsepower in the MW-9?
 

Mike W

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Nov 3, 2012
Messages
103
Location
Doncaster Yorkshire UK
That MW-9 canopy looks like a simplified version of the Cri-Cri. It combines the minimal profile with the simplicity of a flat-wrapped Cassut canopy. No need for fancy, blown, double curvature in the top of the canopy, where few pilots look anyways. The reviewing pilot admits to being taller than the designed M.W. He probably also strapped his GoPro camera to his forehead, so again, above the line of sight of most sport pilots.
MW-9 is all that the average sport pilot needs in his quest for hundred dollar hamburgers.
With a clever folding scheme, you might even fit an MW-9 into an ISO 20 shipping container.

How many horsepower in the MW-9?
I agree the plank has to be the minimum aircraft to build and store, less parts drag and cost. The MW9 airframe cost me around £1000 to build and £2500 for the engine, budget flying.
The engine is a single cylinder Ciscomotors Bull Max. 230cc 33 BHP at 7600 RPM.
The wings un plug for transport and storage.
 

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