Ferrying an EAB that has current airworthiness documentation and out of phase 1

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KeithO

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Ok folks. After the roller coaster experience with the Titan Tornado with invalid documentation, I am now looking at a single seat EAB BK 1.3 that is located on the east coast.

It has current registration as an EAB, it meets the LSA category requirements for weight, speed, stall etc.

I have a ferry pilot to pick it up and fly it back to Michigan. The pilot is commercial rated. I would be paying for the pilots time basically.

Are an special permits or LODA needed for such a flight ? If no money changed hands it would just be a normal cross country flight, but the commercial pilot expects to be paid for his time to move the airplane.

Comments ? It would probably cost me more money to obtain a suitable trailer, remove the wings and trailer the plane home. Also a much greater risk of damage to the plane itself in this scenario. It seems the most expedient thing to do is have the plane ferried from 1 airport to another.

I do not have my pilots license and my wife is a student pilot. The goal of buying this plane is for her to build time as a private pilot. She would solo in a trainer (C150 or C172) then get some transition training in an RV-12 and then should be able to fly the BK-1.3 for much of her remaining hours as a PP.
 

AeroER

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Your wife will build time as a mechanic, homebuilt airplane troubleshooter, and homebuilt airplane completer.

Build time in the BK after obtaining the private pilot certificate and more experience while she is learning how to fly.
 

kent Ashton

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Wrong airplane at the wrong time. Neither of you can train in a single-place airplane. Her instructor might not sign her off for solo in an airplane where he cannot fly with her and anyway, the solo hours are minimal and do not train her for a checkride in a 2-place trainer. Waste of money, I think.
 

Daleandee

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Opinions are like arm pits ... everyone has a couple that stink. I'm with Kent on this one. If you and your bride will eventually become pilots I'd suggest that you look for a two seat aircraft. It makes transition training easier and it will allow the two of you to fly together. Side by side seating is probably her preference, but tandem will be something you might consider now and again ... ;)
 

cblink.007

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Are an special permits or LODA needed for such a flight ? If no money changed hands it would just be a normal cross country flight, but the commercial pilot expects to be paid for his time to move the airplane.
Not 100% sure on this; I'd ask an FAA field office for better, more precise guidance, but my gut says you might need a LODA.

But I concur with the other contributors to this thread. I think you'd be better served getting a 2-place instead of a single. Flying is an adventure worth sharing!
 

KeithO

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We are building an RV-9A that will be set up for IFR training. This plane is to fill the gap between now and when the RV-9 will be completed without spending a huge amount of money renting a C172 and dealing with the issues of trying to find available time on the C172 in the summer when everyone wants to fly it.

There is an operation in Owosso about an hour north that has a Vans RV-12 and once she is comfortable soloing in that I think she would have no problem flying the BK-1. Aircraft prices are nuts right now so its just not the right time to be trying to buy a 2 seat trainer. $35k for a C150 with 2800 hours on the engine since overhaul ? Thats what is being asked right now.
 

Victor Bravo

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Buy a $22K Taylorcraft, have a huge amount of fun, be able to do both of your training in it, learn to be higher quality pilots than you otherwise would, save a !)#*$ bundle on fuel, and you will both look like a class act when you roll up to the fuel pumps.

When it's all said and done, the airplane will be worth whatever you bought it for and perhaps a little more. So calculate that into your cost equation :)
 

KeithO

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Buying a taildragger where I live, even if 2 seat pretty much guarantees that you will NOT find a CFI to work with. There are several Sonex 2 seaters for sale but all are taildraggers and besides the fact that there is not 1 CFI within a 30 mile radius of the airport, trying to find a CFI with a taildragger endorsement would make that a totally hopeless job. I believe there is one place where one can get this endorsement in Michigan and a second in Ohio. So, no, taildraggers are out.

Buy a $22K Taylorcraft, have a huge amount of fun, be able to do both of your training in it, learn to be higher quality pilots than you otherwise would, save a !)#*$ bundle on fuel, and you will both look like a class act when you roll up to the fuel pumps.

When it's all said and done, the airplane will be worth whatever you bought it for and perhaps a little more. So calculate that into your cost equation :)
 

TFF

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I wouldn’t worry about paying someone to ferry. Completely different situation than training or flying for profit.
I don’t know if I would ferry such a plane more than 100 miles; I would trailer.

On a different tack, terrible plane for a no time pilot. Not a terrible plane, wrong for the situation. After 100 hours and some time in something similar like a Sonex two seater. Small airplanes are a different game. It can be intense being all alone in something that doesn’t fly like you have trained. If you buy it, don’t think anyone is just going to hop in it and be fine. It’s also delicate. Look at it wrong and it’s crumpled. It might be cheap, but it’s an advanced pilot plane, or at least to a beginner or is.
 

KeithO

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Passing the checkride is all about experience. Lots of takeoffs and landings, maneuvering, slow flight, stalls, navigation, cross country. That experience is exactly what she can get in spades for $15 an hour in the single seater after she has soloed. It wouldnt matter if it took her 120 hours, she would not need to be under time pressure because it costs $100 for an hour on the hobbs. She can ultimately take her checkride in the RV-12, with very similar characteristics compared to a C172.
 

TFF

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Assuming the plane survives the first few hours. Hopefully she doesn’t get hurt too. It might be less money, but you are cheaping out at the wrong time. Solo endorsement for it too is doubtful. Pretty loose CFI if they do. Each type has to be endorsed, and I doubt someone will sign that. Time in the logbook will not count without it, if she does fly it without the endorsement. After 100 hours, perfect. Too delicate a plane; it’s for tinkering and flying, not cranking out hours.
 
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Dillpickle

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Buying a taildragger where I live, even if 2 seat pretty much guarantees that you will NOT find a CFI to work with. There are several Sonex 2 seaters for sale but all are taildraggers and besides the fact that there is not 1 CFI within a 30 mile radius of the airport, trying to find a CFI with a taildragger endorsement would make that a totally hopeless job. I believe there is one place where one can get this endorsement in Michigan and a second in Ohio. So, no, taildraggers are out.
Hmmmmmmm.....methinks you're looking for an instructor in the wrong places. VB has some ROCK solid advice--that will make you and your wife better pilots and save you some serious money in the long run. (well maybe not SAVING money, but at least not spending as much)
Learning to fly in an old fashioned taildragger aircraft means you will be a little more attuned to the subtleties of flying, simply because they are less tolerant of mistakes. It's a great skill to have. As far as the instructor, he won't be advertising at one of the big flight schools. He'll probably be retired, having breakfast a few days a week at the nearest little airport where taildraggers hang out, and will be far more concerned with your attitude and aptitude than the money in your pocket.

Go find that airport. Makes some friends. You WILL find an instructor who has forgotten more than those kids at the flight school will ever learn.
Please. Don't brush this off.
 

rv7charlie

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The two types of LODA for experimentals (that I'm aware of) are for *training*. Paying a commercial pilot to reposition a plane isn't the same as training.

I'd agree with everyone else about not trying to use a single seater for private training. Even if the instructor would sign her off, there just isn't that much solo time when working on your private ticket.

It's really odd that there are no TW CFIs up there; most wheel/skis and wheel/float a/c are TW. Very little float flying where I live, and no ski at all, but I know a *bunch* of TW CFIs; two or three are my neighbors. I think everybody on my airport is TW rated (only two trikes, a Bonanza and a C150 that hasn't flown in almost two decades, on the field). I'd look harder before giving up on the TW idea, but if that's just not possible, how about an Ercoupe? Find one with rudder pedals.
 

KeithO

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If there are CFI's residing anywhere near where I live they would be in the FAA database, would they not ? I cant drive 2-3 hours to some airport in the middle of no-where for every hour of flight time I will need ?

Hmmmmmmm.....methinks you're looking for an instructor in the wrong places. VB has some ROCK solid advice--that will make you and your wife better pilots and save you some serious money in the long run. (well maybe not SAVING money, but at least not spending as much)
Learning to fly in an old fashioned taildragger aircraft means you will be a little more attuned to the subtleties of flying, simply because they are less tolerant of mistakes. It's a great skill to have. As far as the instructor, he won't be advertising at one of the big flight schools. He'll probably be retired, having breakfast a few days a week at the nearest little airport where taildraggers hang out, and will be far more concerned with your attitude and aptitude than the money in your pocket.

Go find that airport. Makes some friends. You WILL find an instructor who has forgotten more than those kids at the flight school will ever learn.
Please. Don't brush this off.
 

rv7charlie

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Looks like close to a dozen paved surface airports within about 40 mi of Jackson MI, plus who knows how many private strips. Have you visited any EAA chapters? (Are you a member?) Contacted EAA HQ to ask about any lists of CFIs in the area?

Maybe you've done all of the above, but I know when I 1st got serious about flying, I didn't know what I didn't know. Soon discovered a rather large 'underground' that wasn't that, so much as being right in front of me once I got my eyes re-tuned to actually see different stuff.
 

pilot103

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When I was looking to get a tw signoff, There weren't very many around then This was before the internet . I ended up driving about 250 miles for one I found advertised in Trade a plane. I cant imagine there are more now than then.
 
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