Facetmobile

Discussion in 'Aircraft Design / Aerodynamics / New Technology' started by gicummo, Mar 26, 2019.

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  1. Mar 26, 2019 #1

    gicummo

    gicummo

    gicummo

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    Hello,

    What happend with the Facetmovil?... I read a nasa reporta about it that it said it a very good design, etc...
    Does sombody know why this kind of airplane dont go further?

    Regards

    Mario
     
  2. Mar 26, 2019 #2

    vhhjr

    vhhjr

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    There's a Facetmobile in taxi testing in Oregon. It was reverse engineered from the original and is VW powered.
     
  3. Mar 26, 2019 #3

    gicummo

    gicummo

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    I thought about it because its look simple to build.. at least from what I saw.
    Do you know who is testing it?
     
  4. Mar 26, 2019 #4

    markaeric

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  5. Mar 26, 2019 #5

    BJC

    BJC

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    The web site indicates that Barnaby (an occasional poster here at HBA) is participating.


    BJC
     
  6. Mar 27, 2019 #6

    jcoyier

    jcoyier

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    The lead builder (who you see in the photos I took for EAA292) has been in contact with Barnaby and has an agreement with him regarding this project. This is the proto build and if it flies and handles as hoped there are several other chapter members who have already done some of the preliminary epanage construction on their own "hope-to-be" builds. The end product is to be a kit plane.
     
  7. Mar 27, 2019 #7

    lr27

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    I think part of the problem is that people don't think it looks like an airplane.

    Speaking of low aspect ratios, are you familiar with the Dyke Delta? Milt's Little Bird? Verheese Delta? V-173? Arup? There are others. Apparently some were good airplanes.
     
  8. Mar 27, 2019 #8

    Wanttaja

    Wanttaja

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    Some people think it looks kind of half-facet. :)

    The original design dates from a period where people were excited about non-traditional configurations. Nowadays...well, 25% of the homebuilt fleet are RVs, and that's as traditional as it gets.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
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  9. Mar 27, 2019 #9

    WBNH

    WBNH

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    Always an intriguing design. Interesting the chapter is going with Graham Lee / Airdrome Aeroplanes style construction. The original was welded steel I believe.

    Will be interested to see how they handle entry/egress. The original had a trap door in the floor you had to crawl up in to. A kit would benefit (at a weight penalty) of a hard backbone to walk up the spine of the ship and sit down into the seat. The pics don't show them heading that way however. So getting in and out may still be a chore.

    I think the original, while flown solo, was intended to be a three-seater (or maybe I'm recalling that it was a single-seat proof of concept for a later three-seater, I'm not sure.) I wonder how much the EAA chapter scaled it down as it looks as though theirs in intended for on seat.

    If scaled down, and with the change in construction materials, I wonder if they will keep the designation FMX-4. It seems like a derivative that needs a new designation.
     
  10. Mar 27, 2019 #10

    Wanttaja

    Wanttaja

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    Believe that's the chapter that built 14 of the Nieuports at once. So suspect they've got experience in that mode of construction.....

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  11. Mar 27, 2019 #11

    Riggerrob

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    Moderators,
    Please merge this with the last Facetmobile thread.
    Some of us prefer to have all the Facetmobile posts on a single thread ..... even if the thread is 15 years long!

    Glad to hear that a new Facetmobile is taxi-testing in Oregon.
     
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  12. Mar 27, 2019 #12

    Riggerrob

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    ..................
    I think the original, while flown solo, was intended to be a three-seater (or maybe I'm recalling that it was a single-seat proof of concept for a later three-seater, I'm not sure.)
    ................................................................

    The original FMX-4 was a single-seater proof of concept, built of riveted aluminum tubing (similar to Baslee’s Warbird replicas).
    Barnaby Wainfain has sketched two or three versions of 2-seater Facetmobiles.
    His most detailed design study is the report he wrote for NASA about a proposed 2-seater Personal Air Vehicle. The NASA study is available at www.facetmobile.com.
    Barnaby and friends have built dozens of Facetmobile RC models. Barnaby’s latest RC Facetmobile variant resembles a two-seater with shallower outer wing panels.
     
  13. Mar 27, 2019 #13

    bwainfan

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    rc test 1 (2).jpg fmx7 in flight 3.png inflightgrab 1.JPG
    Facetmobile replica in Oregon is taxi testing now. I'm still working on a 2-seat LSA concept. Its gotten as far as a flying RC model and a wind tunnel test. Results look good, so detail design is underway.

    As with all one-person homebuilt projects how fast things will happen is highly dependent on the demands of the rest of my life.
     
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  14. Mar 27, 2019 #14

    Vigilant1

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    Thanks for the update, Dr Wainfan. Is there a link we can follow to learn more about this envisaged 2-seater, or any other bits you can provide (construction method, likely engine, target specs and attributes, etc)?
    Again, thanks for your continued work on this concept.
     
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  15. Mar 27, 2019 #15

    bwainfan

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    Lost of misconceptions here.. The original (N117wd) was built of aluminum tube with rivets and gussets just like the one being built in Oregon. They have made some detail changes and improvements but the overall approach is the same as the original.

    The original airplane was a single-seater and was never intended to have more seats. I had hoped to build a follow-on (FMX-5) 2-seater but that project was overcome by non aviation-related life events and did not get beyond the design phase. As I stated in another post in this thread, I'm currently doing detail design on an LSA-class 2-seater (FMX-7) that I hope to be able to build before I am too old to care.

    As far as designations go: My protocol is to give a new FMX number to each "hull shape", and use letters to designate sub-variants with different details or systems. N117WD was FMX-4D. In my numbering system the Oregon airplane would be an FMX-4E
    (But its their airplane and they can call it anything they want, although if they name it "Fred" I think we will hear from Matthew)
     
  16. Mar 27, 2019 #16

    WBNH

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    Thanks for the clarification. For some reason I conflated it, thinking it was to have a bench behind the pilot like the Dyke Delta. Usually when it comes to aircraft I can trust my recollection, happy to be corrected (don't like spreading disinformation.) Always wished there were more Facets out there getting exposure. Bravo to the team taking up the challenge (-4E.) Looking forward to the FMX-7.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2019
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  17. Mar 28, 2019 #17

    rv7charlie

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    BW,

    Thank you for posting updates here. I've lusted after a 4 seat version ever since helping kill the grass around the original at OSH. Any chance of skipping the 2 seater & going directly to a 'heavy hauler'? ;-)

    And I'd love to hear more about flying/landing characteristics, comparing handling to planes we're likely to be familiar with. I've got time in Cessnas up to the 182, but almost all my time is in 2 seat RVs plus a couple hundred hrs in a Swift. Is it radically different, especially in the landing phase?

    Thanks again; it's great to be able to ask questions directly.

    Charlie
     
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  18. Mar 28, 2019 #18

    Cy V

    Cy V

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  19. Mar 28, 2019 #19

    Turd Ferguson

    Turd Ferguson

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    Well don't forfeit presentations at KOSH !!
     
  20. Apr 15, 2019 #20

    Urquiola

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    Facetmobile is a very interesting machine, but: Why a 2-Stroke engine, why a front propeller? Would it fly same with an electric engine or internal ducted fans? It is a propulsion very well adapted to electric engines, there are lots of Electric ducted fans for industrial applications in the market, generators, also lots of it. You can have a Wankel Rotary Combustion Engine, it's not difficult finding a 45 HP OMC from Snowmobiles, or different variants of avionized Mazdas, see: www.rotaryeng.net
    The PAV derivative of Facetmobile perhaps could be built with a box structure made of the type of building plaster panels having an interior honeycomb structured layer, it is both light and resistant. 'Pladur' is an Spanish commercial brand for this, they offer weight and resistance data, any plastic would make a good cover, I don't like plywood, it's not weather resistant.
    Thanks. Salut +
     

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