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Diamond shows off new Continental Diesel DA 50-RG

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12notes

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It really depends on price, which hasn't been announced. The SR-22T has a base price close to the DA-42 twin engine, it's likely that the DA-50 RG will be significantly cheaper than the SR-22T. Cheaper fuel burn might not make up for the lower cruise speed, but a $100K-200K lower price might.
 

Toobuilder

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So what does all the extra weight "buy" you in the intended market? Is it durability, a plush interior, what?
 

rv6ejguy

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The SR22T base price in 2019 was $730,000. I'm sure your number is close to the average sticker price with options.
The DA-40 base price in 2018 was $430,000. Average sticker price is probably a bit over $500,000.
I can't find a base price for the current DA-42 VI, but here's a new one for sale for $840,000 with over $250,000 of "optional equipment" listed. I'm sure it's heavily discounted, but I'd guess base price is around $750,000. You're probably close for an average sticker price:

The DA42 and DA62 are both twin engine aircraft, the single engine DA50RG has to cost less or they'd be undercutting their own sales with their own models. Cruise speed is about the same as the DA-42, with less range and only slightly better fuel economy at slow cruise (9 vs 10.4 gal/hr). It's also definitely going to be more expensive than the DA-40.
You'll definitely get change from a million dollar bill if you buy a base model DA50 RG, but I'd guess less than half. $600,000 is probably in the ballpark.

DA50s are $650 to 700K depending on model. The RG will be well in excess of that, minimum $800K would be my guess. The engines are over $100K alone I believe, add in that new gear and all the other airframe changes and being the new single engined flagship and all...
 

TarDevil

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There are several reasons I'd look hard at Diamond (maybe not this RG, though)...
  • Unless something has changed since I last checked, there has never been a post crash fire in Diamond aircraft
  • It will "parachute" to the ground without a canopy... at a slower descent rate than the Cirrus under canopy (not sure about the new RG, too new)
  • I like diesel. I like the lower flammability of kerosine
  • I'm retired (wait, no I'm not!), I don't need "fast"
I'm kinda the odd nut with airplanes. If efficiency were my prime motive, definitely the Cirrus
 

12notes

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DA50s are $650 to 700K depending on model. The RG will be well in excess of that, minimum $800K would be my guess. The engines are over $100K alone I believe, add in that new gear and all the other airframe changes and being the new single engined flagship and all...
They've never had offered the DA-50 for sale, ever, they've only built 2 prototypes, one in 2007, and the RG last year. Not sure where you got those prices from, but they're not for a DA-50.

I found a base price for a 2020 DA-40NG, $473,000. The twin engine, retractable gear, 197kt cruise DA-42VI's base price is around $750,000, there's no way they would try to sell the 181kt cruise, single engine DA-50RG for more than the DA-42.
 

rv6ejguy

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They've never had offered the DA-50 for sale, ever, they've only built 2 prototypes, one in 2007, and the RG last year. Not sure where you got those prices from, but they're not for a DA-50.

I found a base price for a 2020 DA-40NG, $473,000. The twin engine, retractable gear, 197kt cruise DA-42VI's base price is around $750,000, there's no way they would try to sell the 181kt cruise, single engine DA-50RG for more than the DA-42.
I found this: Diamond DA-50 Superstar - Price, Specs, Photo Gallery, History - Aircraft Compare and several other references with similar pricing. Yes, you are correct, it looks like Diamond decided not to offer the DA50 and will now jump to the DA50 RG. DA62s are over 1 million new. Not a stretch to think the 50 RG will be over $800K.

From The Aviation Consumer May 2017, updated Oct. 2019: "That means invoices in the high six figures, says Dries (CEO of Diamond). The DA50-IV, for example, will sell for an estimated $650,000 while the -VII will be north of $800,000."
 
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12notes

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rbarnes

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DA-42VI's base price is around $750,000, there's no way they would try to sell the 181kt cruise, single engine DA-50RG for more than the DA-42.
Please point out the last "base price" plane you saw someone purchase ? I'd lay $100 on the table that outside of flight schools Diamond has sold 0 base price DA-42's. A nicely equipped DA-42 or SR22T will run you more like $900k. The DA-50RG is a "5 person airplane" and most definitely sell for more than a DA-42, but not by much.
 

BJC

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Sure? The Cirrus sells for comfort, CAPS, Lifestyle, but if efficiency was the goal, there are better aircraft.
Yup, a fully loaded Boeing 747 is very efficient st high speed transport. A motor glider throttled back to cruise at max L/D is also efficient.

Everything is a compromise around what the buyer wants.

Efficiency is relative, and a convenient justification.


BJC
 

12notes

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Please point out the last "base price" plane you saw someone purchase ? I'd lay $100 on the table that outside of flight schools Diamond has sold 0 base price DA-42's. A nicely equipped DA-42 or SR22T will run you more like $900k. The DA-50RG is a "5 person airplane" and most definitely sell for more than a DA-42, but not by much.
I compare base prices because it is nearly impossible to find two identically equipped planes to compare. The base models have similar equipment, the options aren't going to be significantly different in price between the two manufacturers, so it's the only sane number to use when comparing the price of these planes from these two manufacturers. For example, if the base prices are $150,000 different, then identical options on both planes will still have pretty close to a $150,000 price difference.

If you want to believe that they're going to sell a twin engine, faster plane for less than their newest, slower single engine, I can't stop you. But it doesn't make a bit of sense from an economic or business standpoint.
 

pfarber

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What does an Evolution 850 cost ?

View attachment 102784

1 mio mentioned here: Lancair Evolution - Wikipedia
Does it really matter?

The FAA will kill GA because manufacturers just don't give a crap about GA. There is absolutely no reason why GA parts cost what they do (no, do NOT tell me liability or small runs... that's just a lie).

Unless the FAA starts to push MOGAS (aka AD every plane to MOGAS that currently has an STC, then give tax credits to airports to install MOGAS pumps).

There is no reason why a replacement cylinder is still $800-$1000+ Other than they can.

The EAA had good results pushing non-TSO'd EFIS into certified planes, but the big money is still the engines. And even with certified parts, certified mechanics, manditory inspections etc engines still break. IIRC the highest failure point of a motor is right after a rebuild. That alone should tell you there is a problem.

So no, these diesel engines and Jet A is not the solution. MOGAS and significantly cheaper, lower TBO engines that cost $2000 to rebuild is the solution.
 

TFF

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It is liability. As in liability insurance. I would put it at 20% of each new aircraft and more for any new part. Right off the top. Unless it’s like Robinson helicopters or Icon where they carry no liability insurance but you have to sign away the right to sue them and if you sell the aircraft you have to get the buyer to sign that right away. Robinson flight insurance if you crash one, they only pay in another aircraft, they will not hand you money. If you don’t want it, you have to sell it.
 
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