DA-11 no longer in Midland Museum.

Discussion in 'Aircraft Design / Aerodynamics / New Technology' started by nickec, May 12, 2016.

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  1. May 24, 2016 #21

    Victor Bravo

    Victor Bravo

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    Put in a call to the CAF, and learned that their Midland museum is closed (became another museum).

    Left a message for the CAF curator, when I get a call back I will ask him/her where the aircraft went.
     
  2. May 25, 2016 #22

    nickec

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    I phoned several times leaving messages and eventually heard back from a location other than Midland.

    You calls will help underline the level of interest.
     
  3. May 25, 2016 #23

    nickec

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    I also used the private message function of the forum to attempt to contact Weston.

    No joy as yet. No reply from Weston.
     
  4. May 26, 2016 #24

    Turd Ferguson

    Turd Ferguson

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    Sure, you'd like to think they have a transparent process and I'm sure some museums do. However, check out the process for this museum. Item being offered on ebay right now:

    1961 French Nord 3202 Trainer Aircraft | eBay

    I see the Adam A500 is also on display there. Must be Wings over Rockies Air and Space Museum.

    I also know a case where a museum has sold articles through back room deals.
     
  5. May 26, 2016 #25

    BJC

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    Many museums struggle to exist, even those with excellent collections. A benefactor, such as the imperial government, Boeing, Red Bull, etc. is a huge benefit. Small ones are mostly labors of love, kept open by dedicated volunteers. EAA sold lots of stuff a year or two ago, although I don't think that any airplanes were included. As the veterans of WW II, Korea, and Viet Nam leave us, I fear that fewer and fewer aircraft museums will survive.


    BJC
     
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  6. May 26, 2016 #26

    Turd Ferguson

    Turd Ferguson

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    Many items donated to EAA are sold if they have any value. Donated airplanes are often parted out and sold unless it is something with significant historical connection to the EAA movement. They keep a handful of planes around for kids to crawl on at KidVenture. The reality is they get a lot of donated goods and they would rapidly run out of storage space if they kept everything.
     
  7. May 26, 2016 #27

    MX304

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    I spoke with Leon's son Harold a couple of days ago. The DA-11 is still in Midland in a private hangar. It may end up in the Petroleum Museum along side Jim Hall's race cars but that is not a 100% done deal at this time. I'll update if I hear anything more.
     
  8. May 26, 2016 #28

    Victor Bravo

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    Been playing phone tag with the CAF museum guy, I will hopefully hear back from him this morning, and will report what I hear. Thank you to all the other interested people who are tracking this airplane down.
     
  9. May 26, 2016 #29

    Victor Bravo

    Victor Bravo

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    Just spoke to the right person at CAF, the airplane is at a private strip a few miles north of Midland belonging to a Mr. Mabee, who is apparently a well known private aircraft collector. Apparently he is and was the owner of the aircraft, and it was not ever legally owned by CAF. It was probably "on loan", and put underneath the B-29 tail just to wow the museum visitors with the range of airplane sizes.

    This jibes pretty well with the story MX304 related, so as far as I can see, case closed.
     
  10. May 29, 2016 #30

    nickec

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    Regarding the above post: I too am working to clone the DA-11. After I finish some travel outside the US, I hope to visit the private hangar of Mr. Joe Mabee, who now owns the aircraft. (See posts below. JM has shed this mortal coil.)


    I will share what I have/uncover concerning the Leeon Davis DA-11.
     
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  11. May 29, 2016 #31
  12. May 31, 2016 #32

    nickec

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    I wanted to take measurements of the DA-11. I know some dimensions.

    Examples:

    Wing panel is 66" long on each side of the fuselage with a 30.1" chord.
    The removable tanks in the leading edge abut the fuselage where the chord increases slightly.
    Total wing span is 153".
    Estimated outside fuselage width at wing: 21".
     
  13. May 31, 2016 #33

    Swampyankee

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    US museums, if they get any federal funding will likely get it through the NEA. As that gets defunded, largely due to partisan politics, aviation museums are going to get hurt, especially since most aviation museums don't have the endowments of someplace like MOMA, and have very bulky artifacts that are more delicate than they look.

    Want more of these museums to survive, get out there and raise money. Hit the phones.
     
  14. May 31, 2016 #34

    Hot Wings

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    I'd forget about a pure clone and just use the basic idea to design a clean sheet design that fits an average American male.
     
  15. May 31, 2016 #35

    plncraze

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    Contact Magazine had a real good Davis article and rhey sell back issues. Check their website.
     
  16. May 31, 2016 #36

    sotaro

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    Contact Magazine #41 reprint only
    "Leeon Davis shares his work on the 16HP Briggs and Stratton engine in his DA-11."
     
  17. May 31, 2016 #37

    nickec

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    I have the reprint of the Davis engine article already and have commented elsewhere about prop questions based on Leeon's answers from the article.

    There is another reprint containing Davis info which I have yet to invest in:

    ISSUE 32 Available in reprint only

    Early EAA pioneer and record holder Leeon Davis of Davis DA-2A V-tail design fame has designed a new racer. Full details! ...
     
  18. May 31, 2016 #38

    Victor Bravo

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    Hot Wings wrote:
    "I'd forget about a pure clone and just use the basic idea to design a clean sheet design that fits an average American male. "

    +1

    Although the Davis designs are clever, historically significant, and represent a really good bang for the buck, IMHO they are not perfect and they are not for everyone. Mr. Davis was apparently a very small size, light weight man. The guy shown flying the DA-11 in the one available video is also a smaller sized person.

    The recent advances and "state of tune" available in the V-twins will provide nearly twice the power of the original 16HP Briggs. This is what allowed Colomban and Spacek to design larger aircraft for larger people using the same base engine as Davis. So a "modernized" and "reality-ized" DA-11 could now be larger for a large pilot. Obviously somewhere half or 3/4 of the way between the DA-11 and the DA-5 in all likelihood.

    However, the DA-5 plans that I have show a pretty complicated weldment at the back for the V-tail mounting, made up from a hundred different size tubes, all coped and fish-mouthed together, and needing to be aligned with some amount of precision before welding. It surely seems to me that building this subassembly will take as much time as building one of the wings.

    The V-tail is of course a Davis signature item, and it may offer lower drag than most "conventional cruciform" tails... but it's certainly not the most efficient as far as I can tell. The Colomban Luciole manages to offer an easy (MUCH EASIER!!) to build tail, with fewer aerodynamic intersections than the Davis V-tail, and with far fewer parts, hinges, spars, etc.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2016
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  19. May 31, 2016 #39

    billyvray

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    I agree with you. Most of the Davis planes are exceedingly simple in design, and the Vtail mount almost seems from a different designer. Basically it is just a weldment for fixing the the two bearing carriers in place. It attaches to the rear fuselage and is well-braced to the rear.
    I think a more simple arrangement could be designed.

    Shown here for illustration.

    View attachment Vtail Mount.pdf

    Bill
     
  20. Jun 10, 2016 #40

    nickec

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    As I am back in Texas, I again hope to locate, visit, and measure the Davis DA-11, wherever it may be.

    Any help is much appreciated. Thanks.
     

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