Crashes in the News - Thread

Discussion in 'Rules and Regulations / Flight Safety / Better Pil' started by choppergirl, Jun 8, 2016.

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  1. Jun 10, 2016 #101

    bmcj

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    Excellent point! I thought it was just the drivers in my town that we're getting bad, but I guess it's a more universal problem. I don't necessarily judge someone who skirts just outside of the driving rules as long as it has no impact on others, but what I have seen lately is a vast multitude of drivers now who scoff at the rules and make drastic moves for their own convenience despite the fact that they are endangering others and negatively impacting the flow of traffic.

    I suppose that mindset probably makes its way into aviation too.
     
  2. Jun 10, 2016 #102

    N8053H

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    I believe this effects women just as much if not more then "guys".
     
  3. Jun 10, 2016 #103

    bmcj

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    Probably not the way it is, but should be...

    If the accident was caused by the flying plane, I would call it a flying accident.

    If the accident was caused by the taxiing aircraft, I would call it a taxi accident.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2016
  4. Jun 10, 2016 #104

    Wanttaja

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    I have a "Taxi Accident" category which this would nominally be entered as. Part of the difficulty in doing my kind of analysis, though, is making exactly this type of decision. Trying to maintain some consistency is hard, especially when there are years separating looking at two different accidents. I do record secondary causes on complex cases. Over time, I do re-review accidents and occasionally change my decision.

    I'll take a look at my database when I get home tonight, and see how I scored that one. Or re-scored it. :)

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  5. Jun 10, 2016 #105

    Dan Thomas

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    As an instructor I found the ladies to be more careful with the airplane and much less likely to take stupid chances when flying. Teststerone levels have a lot to do with the difference in male and female behavior, at least when they're young.
     
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  6. Jun 10, 2016 #106

    Victor Bravo

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    I see you haven't met Estrogen yet...
     
  7. Jun 10, 2016 #107

    Turd Ferguson

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    My experience has been one extreme to the other. I have trained some women were were very good pilots, including my wife. On the other hand, there was 1 or 2 that I was scared for- as they were not in possession of the big picture required to scare themselves.
     
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  8. Jun 10, 2016 #108

    Turd Ferguson

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    It's still hard to call in this specific accident. Could say the taxiing RV-8 caused the crash by being in the wrong place at the wrong time, or; The Velocity caused it cause they were flying down the taxiway.

    I just know it was an awful crash, hope to never see/hear of anything like that again.
     
  9. Jun 10, 2016 #109

    N8053H

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    Something like this women.

    [video=youtube;fjrxfrr7oE8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjrxfrr7oE8[/video]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2019
  10. Jun 10, 2016 #110

    Turd Ferguson

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    I have seen that video but don't have any information to form an opinion one way or the other. Don't know if she received any training or not and if so, what was the quality of the training.

    The gal in the Cirrus at HOU definitely had training but was in way over her head. The demands of the environment exceeded her abilities by a large margin which gives the illusion she wasn't able to perform much better than the gal in this video.
     
  11. Jun 10, 2016 #111

    N8053H

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    I would say the quality of training this lady received was nil to none. But the point, how many reading this post would even climb into a single seat with the amount of knowledge this woman had in controlling an airplane? I believe most of us value life more then this and do not want to be a statistic.
     
  12. Jun 10, 2016 #112

    Turd Ferguson

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    On the other hand she could have been well trained and had mechanical malfunction to deal with. Just don't know.
     
  13. Jun 10, 2016 #113

    Victor Bravo

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    The ultralight crash LOOKS like it had something to do with a control cable or pushrod coming loose. The airplane was behaving like the control stick came loose. Wafting around in circles like that aimlessly makes me smell a control system issue much more than a pilot who did not know how to fly.

    In the homebuilt world, let's please all remember that most "normal" airplanes can USUALLY be controlled and steered to a safe landing spot using the rudder only, and anything past that is gravy. Then let's try like hell to prevent ourselves from having to use that knowledge!
     
  14. Jun 11, 2016 #114

    Wanttaja

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    I checked, and I did count that as a mid-air. MIA08FA070A & B. This is one of those that's arguable as either a mid-air or a taxi accident.

    "The accident, an on-ground collision between two airplanes at a non-towered airport, occurred when the lead airplane in a flight of four RV-8s, which had landed and exited the runway, was struck by a Velocity not associated with the flight. Witnesses stated that the flight of four RV-8s announced their intentions to land in formation on Runway 15 over the radio and on the same frequency that the Velocity announced its intention to conduct a straight in approach to Runway 15. The Velocity arrived on final just behind the fourth RV-8, and touched down on the runway close to the approach end. The Velocity then drifted left off the runway and onto the grass. It passed to the left of the three trailing RV-8s that were still on the runway, and struck the lead RV-8, which had cleared the runway to the left on a taxiway in the vicinity of the departure end of the runway. At some point prior to the collision, engine power on the Velocity increased. Examination of the Velocity did not reveal any evidence of preimpact mechanical failures or malfunctions, and the weather in the area was conducive for visual flight rules operations."

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  15. Jun 11, 2016 #115

    StarJar

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    Seems possible, if not probable, that the Velocity went to the left to avoid the RV's in front of it. Nothing like a discussion within a discussion, but maybe a lesson in spacing.
    EDIT: As far as a flight or ground accident; the spacing may have allowed for a non collision in flight, but canards are known for high speed rollouts, which maybe changed everything quickly. Just guessing. Good luck on catagorizing it..:-(
    EDIT; I would say FLIGHT for the Velocity, because it started before touchdown, and even during a botched confused go around.
    As for the RV, just pure bad luck.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2016
  16. Jun 11, 2016 #116

    BBerson

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    One of the promoters said the fatality rate could drop below zero...
    Since driverless cars could have more humans created (in front or back seat) than are killed. :gig:
     
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  17. Jun 11, 2016 #117

    Turd Ferguson

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    Ron - thanks for sharing your methodology. I appreciate it.
     
  18. Jun 11, 2016 #118

    mcrae0104

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    While it may be true that basic airmanship is on the decline (a debatable, if difficult to prove, point), the information age is an interesting paradox. Never in history have so many pilots had so much information and so many training opportunities at their fingertips.
     
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  19. Jun 11, 2016 #119

    radfordc

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    Ummm...Chopper Girl
     
  20. Jun 11, 2016 #120

    BBerson

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    Actually, I think Choppergirl would (or could) teach herself with carefully preplanned small hops of a foot or so flying down a long runway. I AM NOT RECOMMENDING SELF TEACHING HERE.
    But it could be done. In fact, even a private pilot must self teach this way in a VJ-24 because there is no other option on a first solo in any single seater.

    It helps greatly that Choppergirl has flown with her Dad. The worst case would be to try and sight see on the first flight and lose control. Choppergirl doesn't need to get over that first gasp experience of flying and could pay attention to keeping it level.
    In fact, lots of ultralight pilots have learned solo. Usually with an instructor on the ground shouting commands into a radio.

    It is unfortunate that ultralight rides are prohibited. A few rides would help immensely.
    The best plan, I think, would be to find a local pilot with a Cub and take some flights and see how hard it is. Any current pilot, not an instructor.
     
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