Crashes in the News - Thread

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BBerson

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Helicopters are exempt from the 500 feet minimum (and 1000 in cities) above the surface rules.
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But I don't know if that was a factor.
 

davidb

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Helicopters are exempt from the 500 feet minimum (and 1000 in cities) above the surface rules.
91.119
But I don't know if that was a factor.
Right, and helicopters aren’t restricted to one mile visibility while on a special VFR clearance.
 

Saville

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While I know this behavior remains the exception, those exceptions almost always were corporate pilots at the FBO I managed. Straight in downwind approaches, ignoring unicom calls, various other pattern deviations. One Citation pilot chewed out my chief flight instructor for being in the pattern, bragging about his type rating. My CFII proceeded to pull out his license and log book... with his extensive south Pacific experience, numerous type ratings and many thousands of hours... and asked the jet jock to match his credentials. Of course, he couldn't.
That CFII had to take control of our trainers numerous times dodging wild approaches and landings by corporate pilots who were oblivious to other aircraft in "their" airspace.
Again... those were exceptions to most well mannered pilots, but when these incidents occurred it was almost always at the hand of corporate hires.
I will say this... I can't remember even one corporate pilot busting minimums. Lots of shrugged shoulders in the terminal with the fading sound of turbine engines and radio calls diverting to airports with an ILS. One of the corporate pilots based at my airport was called "chicken" because he was afraid of "a little bit of thunder."
Weather got respect, but pattern rules existed for lesser pilots.
So where was the tower during all these "wild approaches"?
 

Vigilant1

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Right, and helicopters aren’t restricted to one mile visibility while on a special VFR clearance.
When that rule was written, I wonder if they considered a day when a helicopter might be doing 175 MPH when operating under Special VFR. Probably not.
 

davidb

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When that rule was written, I wonder if they considered a day when a helicopter might be doing 175 MPH when operating under Special VFR. Probably not.
Part (b) Class G Airspace, Paragraph (1) Helicopter. A helicopter may be operated clear of clouds if operated at a speed that allows the pilot adequate opportunity to see any air traffic or obstruction in time to avoid a collision.

The high speed and high rate of descent (if accurate) indicates they were not in controlled flight at the moment of impact.
 

BBerson

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The track I saw today showed it ended at 2000 feet. Looks like he flew into a hillside.
The tower issued a special VFR for departure. Then tower told him to contact another controller for flight following. He did not contact the controller for flight following. They called him but no reply.
 

D Hillberg

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The track I saw today showed it ended at 2000 feet. Looks like he flew into a hillside.
The tower issued a special VFR for departure. Then tower told him to contact another controller for flight following. He did not contact the controller for flight following. They called him but no reply.
Scud running,
Weather was junk - Was he briefed ? duh...
Why didn't they put a copilot in the left seat?
Once cleared from controlled air space he sealed their fate......
 

davidb

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The pilot was an experienced instructor and highly regarded. We should not write this one off as pilot error. An operation like this should require two pilots. One pilot should focus on trying to progress visually. A second pilot should be on instruments and ready to perform an IFR escape.
 

D Hillberg

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The pilot was an experienced instructor and highly regarded. We should not write this one off as pilot error. An operation like this should require two pilots. One pilot should focus on trying to progress visually. A second pilot should be on instruments and ready to perform an IFR escape.
IFR machine?
Auto pilot?
Oxnard is IFR facility
Orange County is IFR facility ---------> Oxnard (right next to CMA)
Why not do it right?
You know it's IMC somewhere ahead

CFII only works if you teach.
False sense of security - his route shows he wasn't happy about the weather
Why not direct to CMA? IFR vectors or routing???

Why not take advantage of those expensive bells and whistles?
Pilot done 'F'ed up....
 

TarDevil

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The pilot was an experienced instructor and highly regarded. We should not write this one off as pilot error. An operation like this should require two pilots. One pilot should focus on trying to progress visually. A second pilot should be on instruments and ready to perform an IFR escape.
One pilot, two pilots... this awakens all the warning signs handed down since I first griped an airplane's controls.

I once... JUST ONCE... got a special VFR for the last 20 miles of a trip threading through tall buildings.
That cured me for the remainder of my flying - with multi/instrument/commercial ticket in my wallet. If it's IFR, file. Otherwise, don't go.

To your point; if the trip required a second hand at the controls and he departed without them... STILL pilot error.
 

davidb

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His goal was to get someplace specific. We don’t know if any IFR option would achieve that goal. I’m sure the pilot felt some pressure to get it done. Hindsight says poor judgment.
 

Richard6

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It appears that there was considerable fire which consumed a lot of the copter. I assume that the victims were also mostly consumed in the fire.

Also it appears that the craft was not coming straight down, but at an angle that allowed it to bonce once before coming to the final resting spot.

The gal in the video tried to down play the fog issue, but I think that will be the real cause of the crash.

And yes, pilot error.
 

Vigilant1

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The news reports (with all the baggage that comes with that sourcing) says the wait for an IFR clearance and then the wait for sequencing through all the airspace was going to be considerable. The conjecture is that the pilot believed he could accomplish the mission safely under special VFR without the delays. It appears this may have been untrue.
 
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