Crashes in the News - Thread

[pictsidhe]

Meh, a barrage of kites. With engine clogging volcanic ash type payloads. Fishing line is really hard to spot until you are very close. That would delay clearing the tethers. Transparent kites would add to the chaos.
A giant roll of Satan wrap, a few thousand wooden barbecue skewers and some fusible or abrasive substance. Maybe sand?
Look at the chaos the Palestinians wreaked with their home made jumbo fireworks. While high tech can be useful, so can low tech.

 

[mcrae0104]

A giant roll of Satan wrap

They don't stock that item at my local grocery store.

 

[Vigilant1]

They don't stock that item at my local grocery store.

You've never had a sheet of that stuff get all stuck to itself before you could get it over the target dish? He named it right!

 

[BBerson]

They don't stock that item at my local grocery store.

Try a big box church supply store.

 

[bmcj]

I heard that the Planes of Fame’s Northrop N9MB crashed today and was destroyed. No other details or other sources to verify this yet.

EDIT: just found this...
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27594/rare-and-historic-northrop-flying-wing-crashes-into-prison-yard-in-california

 

[Cy V]

Bob Barrows, designer of the Bearhawk, was injured in a crash today:

https://newsline.kitplanes.com/2019/04/23/bearhawk-designer-bob-barrows-injured-in-landing-crash

 

[Mike Stewart]

> "I heard that the Planes of Fame’s Northrop N9MB crashed today and was destroyed."

Oh no! It was always a high point of the show when it would fly at Gillespie Field's "Wings Over Gillespie" show every June. That airshow disappeared several years ago unfortunately but I remember the "flying wing" well. It's a shame such a rare aircraft is now apparently lost for good.

Nice video. I'm glad someone took the time to make it. Although I liked the music, I would have preferred just listening to the engines but, come to think of it, there was probably too much slipstream noise to have recorded well.

 

[bmcj]

Two days ago (Friday) around noon, a Sting Light Sport went down near Madera Airport. I was also up that day flying in the same area. As I did some touch and goes at Madera Airport, I spotted the wreckage of the Sting off the end of the runway as the emergency crews were just arriving. I recognized the plane as the one that belonged to my next door neighbor here at Sierra Sky Park (community Air Park in Fresno). The impact did not appear to be survivable; the wings were intact, but the fuselage was folded. Everything was in one spot with no indication of lateral motion, and the twisted tail looked typical of a vertical spin impact.

I flew back to Sky Park hoping that it was a similar plane, but the neighbor’s hangar was empty and the pilot’s truck was parked nearby. I should say here that my next door neighbor was not in the plane... he inherited the plane and air park home from his pilot father, but has no interest in aviation. The accident pilot was an active member of our air park EAA chapter and was building a home here (two doors down) and was going to buy the plane. The passenger (also killed) lived nearby, and was also a member of our chapter, taking lessons from the pilot and just shy of his first solo.

I feel fairly certain that this was a stall/spin accident, but what led up to it? Others on the ground at the airport reported that the instructor said they were going out to practice engine failures during take off. I’m not sure if they will be able to determine a cause unless they can find evidence of control problems or actual engine stoppage. It may just be a case of pilot error or perhaps the student making an abrupt input too close to the ground.

BOTH WERE VERY NICE GUYS, AND LEFT FAMILIES BEHIND.

Here are a couple of photos I took and marked (sorry, flying alone trying to take photos out the right side from the left seat while climbing out from the runway), as well as one taken from the news release:

https://www.yourcentralvalley.com/news/local-news/officials-two-confirmed-dead-in-madera-county-airplane-crash-2/1954173096?


LOCATION RELATIVE TO DEPARTURE END OF RUNWAY



MY HOME IN THE BACKGROUND

 

[Turd Ferguson]

In the early '80's I witnessed a nearly identical accident. I was instructing at a little airport and one of the other instructors departed with a student for a training flight. PA28-161. I was walking inside while they departed and right as I opened the door, hear a pop from the engine. Best I can tell they were attempting a teardrop pattern to align with the departure end of the runway. About 3/4 way through the turn, the plane departed controlled flight and went nearly vertical in a soybean field. The distances, lateral offset, wreckage pattern was very similar (eerily similar) to these photos.

 

[BBerson]

I think intentionally practicing engine out and turning back to the runway is extremely risky. I never did it, other than in a trainer glider. Very sad

 

[pictsidhe]

Shouldn't these turns be perfected at a safe altitude?

 

[BJC]

I think intentionally practicing engine out and turning back to the runway is extremely risky. I never did it, other than in a trainer glider. Very sad

Shouldn't these turns be perfected at a safe altitude?

Discussion here https://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/threads/the-“impossible”-turn-and-the-“startle-effect”.31188/


BJC

 

[BBerson]

No "startle effect delay" yet the intentional turn back result is a spin in with an instructor.
My last flight review the instructor grabbed the stick out of my hand shortly after liftoff and pulled the stick back and said: " pretend there is a tree in front of us and we need to clear it".(without prior discussion)
Makes we wonder if I will risk future flight reviews.

 

[blane.c]

If I was to instruct a engine failure immediately after take-off it would be a simple question "what would you do if you lost engine power right now?" And I would be listening for the correct response "I would crash straight ahead". This turning back to the runway is suicidal. It is against the way I was taught. Turning back to the runway is not 180 degrees of turn, it is 360 degrees of turn. It takes 270 degrees of turn to get back around to the runway centerline and then another 90 degrees of turn in the opposite direction to line up with it. Without power this is unlikely to be successful.

 

[Vigilant1]

If I was to instruct a engine failure immediately after take-off it would be a simple question "what would you do if you lost engine power right now?" And I would be listening for the correct response "I would crash straight ahead". This turning back to the runway is suicidal.

Maybe some instructors expect a canned response. It depends on the interpretation of "immediately after takeoff" and even "straight ahead." At some point, depending on acft, climb rate, course, technique, etc, there may be an opportunity to safely get back to that runway (and it might be safer than "crashing straight ahead"). Even in the case of power failure at 100' AGL and over the departure threshold, I'll probably deviate 10 degrees left or right into the dirt to miss a localizer antenna.
Lots of variables.

 

[BJC]

Several years ago, we had double fatalities here, just off the departure end of 36, when a Bonanza lost power and stalled into tall trees. A 20 degree turn to the right would have put them in a shallow lake, with a high probability of survival.

Former Navy and ATP-rated airline pilot.


BJC

 

[TFF]

There are a bunch of CFIs that have not really taught flying. If they are an airline pilot canadate or a doctor building time looking for purpose, getting a CFI is just some more tests. They are going to be doing the flying anyway, why not get it. Airline pilots flying the line at best taught someone 20 years ago. Those are great people to get bi annuals from. They can be not good primary instructors. Why? They tend to be out on a Sunday flight like you are. If you are flying pretty competently, they will let their guard down. Sixth time around doing touch and goes the CFI is looking out the window; he does not notice the student is 10 kt slow and when it breaks it’s too late. Everyone wants a cheap way to get a license. I got a buddy with a CFI so I can get cheap license for beer. I know a dozen CFIs. All great people. Only two are really competent primary teachers, half the rest are ok for some of the upper level concepts. The rest I have had to show them something they got wrong. That was in my perceptual ppl student days. It’s not their specialty. Plenty of times I have had to explain to commercial pilots they are overextending their authority into pt 135 and they should not do something. Most people just want to fly and they forget basics really easy.

 

[N91CZ]

I think intentionally practicing engine out and turning back to the runway is extremely risky. I never did it, other than in a trainer glider. Very sad

That is how best to get good at it and you have an engine to abort if it isn’t working out. Know your plane, it’s abilities and limitation.

 

[N91CZ]

Maybe some instructors expect a canned response. It depends on the interpretation of "immediately after takeoff" and even "straight ahead." At some point, depending on acft, climb rate, course, technique, etc, there may be an opportunity to safely get back to that runway (and it might be safer than "crashing straight ahead"). Even in the case of power failure at 100' AGL and over the departure threshold, I'll probably deviate 10 degrees left or right into the dirt to miss a localizer antenna.
Lots of variables.

Exactly right. I evaluate each climbout for the point at which a turn back is achievable, either direct to the runway or to down wind. I know how low my abeam point can be to allow a successful landing.

 

[BJC]

Chris, please share your technique in the discussion thread.

https://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/threads/the-“impossible”-turn-and-the-“startle-effect”.31188/


BJC