# Brutality Today

Discussion in 'Hangar Flying' started by choppergirl, Aug 4, 2017.

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1. May 27, 2019

### Hot Wings

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IIRC in a previous post the former owner ground looped it and then tried to convert a 'dragger to training wheel.

2. May 28, 2019

### choppergirl

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That's where the front tricycle wheel crumpled when David ran out of his home made runway and hit the soft mushy dirt of a plowed field and flipped the plane on it's back in test #1.

~

Let's see, fits out my driveway... relocate the mailboxes; take our tree limb saw liberally to lots of branches on both sides of the road; keep it on the ground gaining speed until hill starts to drop off, peel out in a climb and cut 20% left following road depression over trees and telephone/power lines, but under nuclear reactor high voltage tower power distribution lines...

If I cut down those two big trees on the left... and made them disappear. Maybe some flashing rotating warning lights along the road, warning aircraft is about to take off. Plenty of straight length, next to zero traffic on this dead end, just need a clear shot entrance and exit approach.

If I put reflective tape and warning triangles and backup beepers and orange reflective tape on it, technically it becomes construction equipment, right? No need for license plates or insurance on construction equipment to use on the road. Not that I really care... I've already decided I want it yellow and orange anyway.

Think I'll wait until I get brakes on it (if ever) before I try any landings on pavement. Grass is nice for stopping you.

I don't know, what do you daydream about, when fetching the mail from the mailbox. Getting another Guideposts Magazine? Because, this is what I'm thinking...

Last edited: May 28, 2019
3. May 28, 2019

### choppergirl

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HITCH

As far as my homemade hitch was concerned, it worked just fine over 800 miles towing an empty trailer over some mean stretches of interstate, and another 800 miles back with plane on top. I had the same misgivings about it in the two hours or less I used to whip it up - however, compared to a aftermarket bolt on square hole hitch that sticks the load/weight backwards and twists the bumper just the same it's really no different - which gave me, in my mind, the go ahead. It's just attached with one big bolt instead of 4 smaller ones, and the deep notch I put in prevents it from rotating left or right. Plus I had the safety chains safety wired up pretty good.

I did note my improvised hitch makes the trailer perfectly level when the trailer is empty, but with a plane on it with most weight forward of trailer wheels, the front of the trailer is then too low and the rear is sticking up... and in that situation, the ball on the bumper is then the perfect height once plane (weight forward) is on trailer. Now that I know that, I'll only need it when trailer is empty and has to go long distances. I was worried having the back end low, it would be catching any major bump or dip exiting parking lots / truck stops, therefore my quick and dirty hitch solution to lower the ball X inches and also stick it a bit further back for wider turning radius. The few inches that it added really gave it a quite a bit more margin of safety for turning radius. I must of measured the old light pickup truck in our field when deciding if I'd have enough tongue length or not for full turning radius of the back end of the truck, instead of the actual truck that got used which was wider by a bit.

As far as buying a specialty $250-$350 hitch custom made for that brand truck, well in the time I had (less than half a day), and for the price, that was way out of the question. I saw no hard points underneath to even attach something like that, which perplexed me, because my first route solution was to build the same thing myself (which is what I did for the Ford Taurus when i went to pick up the Volmer).

TRAILER BUILD TIPS

Here's some of what I learned from modifying a boat trailer / building a trailer, now that I've done it. I posted this to a Youtube video, but I'll repost it here, maybe it can help someone going down that road. Hit me up should you ever do it and you got a question, maybe I ran into the same thing and came up with a clever way to do it. A few things I spent a lot of time puzzling out the best way to do them out of several methods I brainstormed.

TIPS...

1) If you start from absolute scratch with new U channel, you can weld your trailer up it exactly the dimensions you want it, and make it a nice rectangle from the get go, and have the floor mount right to the metal frame without wood crossbeams; that may save some weight of not needing wooden cross members, and get your trailer that much lower, and you won't have to engineer extensions to the front and real like I did to a triangle fronted boat trailer, which required a bit of puzzling out.

2) If you start with a boat trailer and modify it, get one in good condition. I started with a rusty old piece of junk I got free off of craigslist, and that added a lot of unnecessary work. And again, puzzles for adding length forward and backwards (I used a lot of bedframe L channel, and also windmill antenna steel from our old Aeromotor windmill).

3) Use one neutral enamel paint color across the entire trailer - grey (probably best, hides dirt), propane tank silver (looks like metal and hides dirt, what I went with because it's my universal color for everything metal), black (carbon tough), white (high visibilty), orange, whatever. As you build, it will save you a lot of trouble as you'll be painting every new addition or touching up things, if you stick to one single color across the entire trailer. Be sure to paint everything with primer first... I used Rustoleum rusty metal primer. Brown in color; I got all the rust off first with whizer wheels, grinders, vingar, phosphoric acid, etc.

4) Torque, Loctite, and paint over every bolt and nut like the do the golden gate bridge, as if nobody will ever come back to it for the next 30 years. Because they won't. Painting over bolts and nuts is the best way to keep the water and rust out. I nicknamed this "golden gating" because that's how they do it on the golden gate bridge.... start painting from one end, when they get to the other, start back all over and paint over everything. As far as torquing is concerned, I probably torqued too strong, because mine is a piece of junk and only goes so low... but I just wanted to get every bolt close to the same, more than I was worried about being a little off for the value. There are guides, but they all say different things, so really I just used my best judgement and often set my torque wrench to the lowest value I could on small bolts.

5) I made my trailer 20ft x 80 inches wide. You may not need one that wide, but I did, because of David's 76" wide rear tricycle landing gear. If you go wider than about 75", and enclose it, you'll probalby need mirrors extensions on a small pickup truck. A bigger wider pickup truck, maybe you won't with a 80" wide trailer. Something to keep in mind, being able to see around it should you ever enclose it. If left flat, no problem.

6) I added a few gimmicks to mine, like that you can swing out the rear tail lights to the side so they won't get busted while loading; a junction box for the electrical wiring; and a 4ft extension on back that can be removed as necessary. In the end, the only one that was useful was the junction box, because it helped me figure out the trailer tail light wiring on the truck which was fucked up and mangled bad. Trailer wiring kits are universally garbage, so I substituted ethernet network cable run through PVC pipe mounted with electrical conduit clamps, so I can be sure that stuff will never, ever fail or fall off for the next 50 years.

7) Drilling holes in steel is a royal p.i.t.a. It's brutal hard work, and you'll have to drill a lot of them. Expect to break a lot of drill bits. Keep your bit speed moving slow, use oil, pre-drill a pilot hole, and press hard. You could I guess make your trailer out of $aluminum and it will be lighter and easier to drill, if you are good at welding aluminum. You can probably skip a lot of painting a derusting that way. I went with steel because it was free and what I had. Some good videos on Youtube about how to drill steel. As my friend said, steel wants to be "milled", which was his way of telling me keep that drill bit slow. I tried to match the same speed with my hand drill as my drill press. If you can drill *any* part on the drill press, use the drill press... as the drill press can go through steel like a lit match through butter (compared to hand drill). Don't know why, maybe it's the fulcrum pressure action of the lever, maybe it's the speed being just perfect for the job. 8) My trailer has tandem axles just because that's what I got free. Nothing special, probably makes it that much more unnecessarily complex than just having two tires. However, I ran into no problems going around turns with them, even tight turns, despite the geometry against them when it comes to turns and everybody saying so about them. Most of the time you're going straight anyway. At first you might try to make your turns as wide as possible, but after a while, you just don't care. You just watch that long back end not to clip anything. It's easy to forget the trailer is even back there, esp. if it's a low flatbed. 9) Put your rear lights where they won't get crushed and beat up. Probably some welded cages around them would be a good idea. 10) Rolls of reflective tape is cheap on ebay, buy some. Use it liberally. In fast moving interstate traffic at night, you want your trailer lighting up like an Xmas tree from people's headlights, esp in rain or fog when visibility is very low. Buy the white, that's about all you need, it's has the highest reflection. I bought red/white, and found, the white is just brighter and all you need. 11) Spare tires, bearings, dust caps... dust cap came in handy when one fell off from a pothole and was lost. 12) Don't forget how your tie down straps will attach. I bought some quick hook links / screw chain links to use with my tie down straps to go around the Uchannel, instead of relying on the hook which is useless. On the long strap end you can go through the eye of one hook, but on the ratchet end, you need a link because you can't fit that ratchet through the hook eye to make a loop. Some of them from HF we found had short ends on the ratchet end and are unusable, even with the links, while others of the same orange from HF were fine. So length of the ratchet end strap varies at HF between the same item code for low end 400 lbs ratchet tie down straps. Something to keep in mind when you buy them. Buy one pack, cut it open in parking lot, measure ratchet strap end, and if it's the long, go buy more of the same. Last edited: May 28, 2019 4. May 28, 2019 ### Turd Ferguson ### Turd Ferguson #### Well-Known Member Joined: Mar 14, 2008 Messages: 4,555 Likes Received: 1,555 Location: Upper midwest in a house air vent? lexan panel for better visibility? 5. May 28, 2019 ### Dana ### Dana #### Moderator Joined: Apr 4, 2007 Messages: 8,457 Likes Received: 2,855 Location: CT, USA We don't delete non abusive on topic posts. A for covering / paint, unverified saffron with latex house paint is the cheapest, and probably the least toxic as well. 6. May 29, 2019 ### choppergirl ### choppergirl #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 31, 2015 Messages: 1,508 Likes Received: 514 Location: AIR-WAR.ORG ★★☠★★ Airwar SouthWest... New Video in my mailbox from Greg... your daily dose of shark teeth... and pirate.... Guess he took a break from working on the VJ-23. My opinion is he's going to need more power and prop push on it. Lawn mower engine ain't going to cut it, but maybe he just wants to sustain or prolong. Scoot over Mercedes, and the car named after you, or Wendy, and your burger... Make some room for me... Then there was Edsel... man, listen, what a bum deal, here, you can take my seat. I rather liked the car myself... in baby blue. Not the shifter on the steering column tho.... Last edited: May 29, 2019 7. May 30, 2019 ### choppergirl ### choppergirl #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 31, 2015 Messages: 1,508 Likes Received: 514 Location: AIR-WAR.ORG ★★☠★★ Flying a Big Fan... PB#205. Now I have to clean up and put back together what's in my front yard (#227), to flying like this. Easier said than done. Maybe I should start with the system that makes all the wind and wow I have an electric starter Have to do some redrive maths I guess 503 + 66" pitch block and make cdi ignition system from new ebay stuff Kind of weird to have propeller in center of plane like a DH.2 Last edited: May 30, 2019 8. Jun 20, 2019 ### BJC ### BJC #### Well-Known Member Joined: Oct 7, 2013 Messages: 8,901 Likes Received: 5,750 Location: 97FL, Florida, USA 9. Jul 2, 2019 ### choppergirl ### choppergirl #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 31, 2015 Messages: 1,508 Likes Received: 514 Location: AIR-WAR.ORG ★★☠★★ Blair Witch Project meets Airwar? I'm very startled. I'm signing up for a local aircraft fabric covering weekend course this month. Last edited: Jul 2, 2019 Charlie Webber likes this. 10. Jul 2, 2019 ### choppergirl ### choppergirl #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 31, 2015 Messages: 1,508 Likes Received: 514 Location: AIR-WAR.ORG ★★☠★★ 11. Jul 2, 2019 ### BJC ### BJC #### Well-Known Member Joined: Oct 7, 2013 Messages: 8,901 Likes Received: 5,750 Location: 97FL, Florida, USA Pink airplane: 12. Jul 2, 2019 ### Hot Wings ### Hot Wings #### Well-Known MemberHBA Supporter Joined: Nov 14, 2009 Messages: 5,998 Likes Received: 2,001 Location: Rocky Mountains 13. Jul 2, 2019 ### Turd Ferguson ### Turd Ferguson #### Well-Known Member Joined: Mar 14, 2008 Messages: 4,555 Likes Received: 1,555 Location: Upper midwest in a house Both of Sue Parrish's pink airplanes are alive and well at the Kalamazoo airport. One in the Airzoo the other in the main terminal. 14. Jul 2, 2019 ### choppergirl ### choppergirl #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 31, 2015 Messages: 1,508 Likes Received: 514 Location: AIR-WAR.ORG ★★☠★★ IDEA: Laminating an airplane wing.... I was riding home today from work, and handling an 8x11 piece of paper I had laminated in a laminating pouch with my home laminating machine, the machine being nothing but two rollers and I guess a heating wire... and it occurred to me... is some tough stuff.... I wonder if it could be used to cover an airplane... it doesn't deform like boat vinyl. Same thickness as boat vinyl... you can heat it and it will fuse together permanently (important), it's clear, you can cut it, and it don't deform if you press on it with your finger, and I don't think it greatly deforms with temperature change (don't know about extremes). You can flex it around curves and it flip flops like a sheet of paper ( the thinner stuff). Bunching it up around complex corners might be a challenge and some cuts and fusing necessary. And I think you can get it in rolls... It's almost like... celluloid film... I guess... maybe not as strong. if you know how strong projector film or camera film is.... I know Conrad Zuse used old projector film as the first computer program tape.... if you have an ID card, it's probably laminated with a heat fusing laminator. It comes in various thicknesses... so... not necessarily as thick as a drivers license... but the same stuff. Don't know anything about UV resistance, etc. I know some people have tried using clear packing tape... seems like this would be even better. You can fuse the edges together. 8x11 pouch is 8 cents retail ($8/100 pack), so probably can get it in huge rolls much cheaper... wonder how it compares to dacron in price.

Oh, and you could sandwich another material between it maybe for additional properties (tear resistance, though it don't seem to tear very easily and is resistant to it in 360 degrees of direction equally.. since its like solid plastic as opposed to a 'weave".). Or print your color scheme for your wing on paper, and then laminate your "printed" paint job "inside" your wing. I'm thinking... what if you laminated friggin Tyvek (those super strong mailing envelopes). I'm going to try it.

So I need a simple tester to test material strength I guess... something like a press with a meter... I bet this guy who's going to be teaching the wing covering class I'm going to will have a punch test tool to use in his demonstration of worn out dacron... I should make up various samples and see how many pounds they can take before failure.

I stabbed a pen through it, like bullet holes, and did some tearing on it. Maybe something different than Tyvek... the laminate on laminate with nothing in between seems stronger... I want something in the middle that would multiply some tear resistance or stop tears...

Last edited: Jul 2, 2019
15. Jul 2, 2019

### narfi

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If you can put it together with heat, wouldn't you be worried it would come apart with heat?
Don't think I would like an Icarus scenario......

16. Jul 2, 2019

### choppergirl

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You have to wait 5 minutes for the laminator to warm up, so it takes a bit of heat to fuse it together.... google search says 300F

The glue that glues the Tyvek fibers to itself does not seem as strong as it could be... I wonder if I laminated dacron, vs painting it to seal the fabric... what I would get for a sandwich.

I notice it's very, very hard to get a tear started with the laminated tyvek... you have to puncture it or damage with some force it in some way... but once you do, its considerably easier to widen / continue a tear along the same line and it usually seperates inside the tyvek fibers... again, maybe it's because the binder in the Tyvek i'm using is like 20 years old and just a cheap mailing envelope.

Last edited: Jul 2, 2019
17. Jul 3, 2019

### robertl

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You can buy very light weight covering fabric, or have envelopes sewn for the wings and such. So why reinvent something that will already do the job ? Unless of course, you just like to experiment, and that's ok too.

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18. Jul 3, 2019

### Turd Ferguson

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Very easy, nothing fancy required.

The only FAA acceptable method of testing fabric is to cut a 1" wide strip and pull it till it breaks. The minimum deteriorated strength is 70% of original. The lighter wt. fabrics (under 2oz) have a breaking strength around 70 lbs. (warp direction) so the minimum deteriorated strength value would be 70% of that. If fabric does not meet that standard is considered non-airworthy.

"punch" type testers were originally designed to test organic fabric. They don't work so good on polyester and in no case can one pronounce fabric is "airworthy" just from a punch test. It's a tool that a mechanic can use when evaluating the condition of fabric, without removing the fabric coatings.

So really all one needs to collect accurate data is way to clamp the fabric and weights from a barbell set

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19. Jul 3, 2019

### Turd Ferguson

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For something like an ultralight, one can buy 1.87 oz uninked fabric (uncertified) from polyfiber and coat it with latex house paint. That will be less than homebrewing an alternative covering that will likely be unstable in sunlight. "Gee, I can't fly today because the sun might overshrink my covering"

20. Jul 4, 2019

### pictsidhe

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A plastic aeroplane. Don't you know what a crazy, ridiculous idea that is?

Well, I do!

Laminiting film comes in mnay varieties. two of the most common are PET. Which is polyester. Aircraft fabric is polyester.
Another one is polypropylene. Tyvek and coroplast are polypropylene. They don't have the strenght to weight of polyester. They are also really difficult to bond to. You need special glues. Special being pronounced ikˈspensiv.
Now you know what the plastics are, you can google their strength and compare it to more conventional materials. If you weigh one of your laminates and work out how much an aeroplanes worth of it will weigh, the polyester dress fabric will suddenly look more appealing. It's the sane choice.

Pink aeroplanes? I like the old ones, here's a camouflage scheme from 1941: