Big TV vs small TV

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Wayne

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Is that display big enough for you? What distance you are reading it from in your plane?
I have not flown behind it Eugene - finishing up my build. I’m the guy that mentioned the 7” Dynon in the Skyhawk and with the density of information believe it’s worth getting a larger display - especially as you as doing all the work and it’s a long term build.
 

Eugene

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I believe Dynon is #1 for experimentals.
I have to agree, looks like Dynon is doing much better job of presenting their product in comparison to everybody else. Pretty good video of explaining things for somebody who doesn't know anything like me. Looks like all components can be installed inside of the panel and display will have all needed numbers including radio controls.

Yesterday on the phone with GRT I asked them for help and I was wondering if they can sell me a package with everything I need, so I can approach this project as completely empty new aircraft. Answer was "no we don't do that". Not very good marketing strategy in my book. Dynon on is light years ahead of them.

I have no idea how I can convince my wife to pay for this, but certainly look very appealing.

Screen Shot 2021-04-22 at 06.20.15.pngScreen Shot 2021-04-22 at 06.17.02.png
 

Bigshu

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Bigger is easier to focus on quickly during a scan.

I hate to say it... But I really like this setup.


When I finally start building, one of the things I've been wondering is breaking it down so that it's cirrus like... One main PFD, a backup - remote the comms/gps and take out 2 more screens. But I'm not sure how that effects cockpit flow, there are times it's nice to have that other box to reach for even if the PFD can do it... Requires a different flow that I wonder if I can adapt to. 30 years of reach for the bendix king gets hard to break.
The 182s we fly in CAP that are G1000 all have the dual screen PFD, MFD setup, with redundancy for all functions. We just got a 172 with the NXi G1000, and I hear it's even more useful for CRM and reducing task saturation for the PIC and the observer.
 

Daleandee

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Some of the monies being tossed about here make my MGL singles and iFly 740b look like a really good deal at about $1500 total. Add another $1400 for the ADSB in & out and I've got all I need for VFR flying.

After our trip to SnF in a Rockwell Commander with the dual Dynon screens (one 7" and a 10"), the dual radios, and the autopilot, I came away very impressed with Dynon. A few years ago I seen a Dynon seminar at one of the ASA gatherings and the presentation taught me a lot about Dynon's approach and the testing they do to make sure their products are as bullet proof as possible. The sad part is I ain't got Dynon monies!

I'm considering an auto pilot as long cross country flying is sweeter in the bumps and tumble when that little voice in the headset says, "autopilot!"

Dale 8~)
 

Eugene

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Some of the monies being tossed about here make my MGL singles and iFly 740b look like a really good deal at about $1500 total. Add another $1400 for the ADSB in & out and I've got all I need for VFR flying.

After our trip to SnF in a Rockwell Commander with the dual Dynon screens (one 7" and a 10"), the dual radios, and the autopilot, I came away very impressed with Dynon. A few years ago I seen a Dynon seminar at one of the ASA gatherings and the presentation taught me a lot about Dynon's approach and the testing they do to make sure their products are as bullet proof as possible. The sad part is I ain't got Dynon monies!

I'm considering an auto pilot as long cross country flying is sweeter in the bumps and tumble when that little voice in the headset says, "autopilot!"

Dale 8~)
I really don't know at this point what kind of money we talking about. If I throw everything away and start from scratch. I want my ELSA to be ready for VFR day and night. With 10 inch screen. What is the bare minimum that I need to spend for today's standards to be legal.? We can skip auto pilot for now and I can add it to my list later for my birthday. She will need to buy me something anyway. Might as well to be an autopilot servos.
 

gtae07

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I really don't know at this point what kind of money we talking about. If I throw everything away and start from scratch. I want my ELSA to be ready for VFR day and night. With 10 inch screen. What is the bare minimum that I need to spend for today's standards to be legal.? We can skip auto pilot for now and I can add it to my list later for my birthday. She will need to buy me something anyway. Might as well to be an autopilot servos.
Last I checked, I think the ballpark is about $10-11k. That's a single-screen VFR Dynon classic system with 2-axis autopilot, COM, intercom, engine monitor, and ADS-B in/out (AP is $1500 for the servos). You might be able to cut that a bit if you watch VAF for used Dynon classic screens.

This is what Dad has in his RV-6. It works fine for a day VFR aircraft that flies cros-countres a few times a year. I've related the story before, but long ago this RV had only bare-minimum VFR steam, a nav/com, and a Garmin 195 (b/w handheld GPS). We flew it that way for 10 years. After a particular trip into deteriorating weather where (non-pilot) Mom had to fly while Dad tried to find a place to get down, she said "I'm not flying with you again till you upgrade the panel", because at that point even she recognized (from what the other RV guys had) the immense benefit in such situations. The moving map, AP, and ADS-B In is wonderful on even a VFR cross-country. I've been to Oshkosh and back twice with that setup and it's light-years beyond the paper-and-steam I trained in. I felt far less fatigue (and had FAR better SA) after Atlanta to Oshkosh than I did after my 150mi XC in training. Save up the extra money and put it in, it's worth it if you intend to travel.
 

Eugene

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ballpark is about $10-11k.
All of a sudden iPad doesn't look that bad anymore!!!

I will make my panel big enough for 10" EFIS, but in two years when I finish my airplane and don't win the lottery, I will put back my steam gauges with Garmin 296 and go for test flight. And as long as it's still legal I will keep doing that until airplane is perfect. Thank you, I had simply no idea about the cost involved. I have some time to think about and try to convince myself for next 2 years that this is the right thing to do. When I'm all done convincing myself, then I will start working on my wife. And how long that will take? I have no idea...
 

BBerson

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The iPad (or iPad mini) or a GPS can be mounted closer to your eyes. Leave the panel as is.
I was in the ultralight tent at 9pm waiting for the downpour to quit. A pilot came in with his iPad and planned his flight home. It's portable.
 
Last edited:

Rhino

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Last I checked, I think the ballpark is about $10-11k. That's a single-screen VFR Dynon classic system with 2-axis autopilot, COM, intercom, engine monitor, and ADS-B in/out (AP is $1500 for the servos). You might be able to cut that a bit if you watch VAF for used Dynon classic screens...
Using the Dynon configurator (Dynon Avionics - Pricing Worksheet), that setup with the top of the line Skyview HDX is $11,385. The configurator doesn't show the Classic, but substituting the lower $1,585 Classic price from their web site (Dynon Avionics | Panel Display | SkyView Classic), this setup would be $9,800. If you used the Skyview price from their web store instead (Store), this setup would be $9,414. I need to note that the prices listed for products on their web site, the prices on the configurator, and the prices on their online web store don't always match. Clicking the "BUY NOW" button on their product web site takes you to the online store, so I have to assume the online store has that actual, correct prices. As a result, count on the HDX system being $24 more than what I've shown, the Classic being $114 more and the SE still being correct, in the total system prices I list above.
 

Eugene

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GPS can be mounted closer to your eyes.
This is really difference between things that we like to have and things that we need to have. It is hard to justify $10,000 just for fun if you really don't need it. But on another hand everything we do in experimental aviation is just for fun.

Seems like yesterday Garmin 496 was best thing that ever happened to us. And we paid big price for this little unit. And this unit was doing for us everything that we possibly wanted at the time. Today we can get this rock solid unit used for only $500. It was so good to us yesterday. Why it's not good anymore today?

Or there is another alternative to iPad, iFly 640 with 7 inch screen that I just discovered. But I don't know nothing about it.

Looks like instruments is just like everything else in aviation - sky is our limit for how much we can spend on it.
 

Yellowhammer

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All of a sudden iPad doesn't look that bad anymore!!!

I will make my panel big enough for 10" EFIS, but in two years when I finish my airplane and don't win the lottery, I will put back my steam gauges with Garmin 296 and go for test flight. And as long as it's still legal I will keep doing that until airplane is perfect. Thank you, I had simply no idea about the cost involved. I have some time to think about and try to convince myself for next 2 years that this is the right thing to do. When I'm all done convincing myself, then I will start working on my wife. And how long that will take? I have no idea...


I feel your pain brother. Ive got one just like her at my house. They never understand.
 

Toobuilder

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There was a time when I had the whole dream list BOM from both Dynon and Garmin for a new panel and I quickly realized one can get a whole lot of bang for the buck with just backing off the "want" list a little. Modern avionics are now a "consumer electronics" product an there are plenty of people who NEED the latest and greatest. Panel upgrades are a hobby unto themselves for some people, so cast offs are readily available. I purchased a Dynon D180 some years ago and am almost perfectly happy with it. Full engine monitor and EFIS in one box. I do not need my panel mount to have aeronatical charts nor synthetic vision - blue sky and brown earth with a horizon line between them is fine. the display is big enough for me and the price is right - used units go for about 1300 bucks today. Add two servos and you have an AP too.
 

Eugene

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There was a time when I had the whole dream list BOM from both Dynon and Garmin for a new panel and I quickly realized one can get a whole lot of bang for the buck with just backing off the "want" list a little. Modern avionics are now a "consumer electronics" product an there are plenty of people who NEED the latest and greatest. Panel upgrades are a hobby unto themselves for some people, so cast offs are readily available. I purchased a Dynon D180 some years ago and am almost perfectly happy with it. Full engine monitor and EFIS in one box. I do not need my panel mount to have aeronatical charts nor synthetic vision - blue sky and brown earth with a horizon line between them is fine. the display is big enough for me and the price is right - used units go for about 1300 bucks today. Add two servos and you have an AP too.

I really like your approach. Thank you. After all many of us driving used cars and buying old houses. I will look into it when I am ready for EFIS.

I discovered that large instrument panel partially blocking my view, especially to the right side. I have decided to change my approach. On pictures below is my attempt to create instrument panel that will have no obstructions to the windshield or windows. I found position of my eyes and start working from there.

Turns out I still need to answer two questions.

#1 - What is the distance from my eyes to the instruments should be in front of me?

#2 - Should my instrument panel be positioned perpendicular to my eyes or little bit down, so I don't see my own reflection.? If so how many degrees is recommended?

IMG_5607.jpegIMG_5606.jpegIMG_5609.jpegIMG_5611.jpegIMG_5612.jpegIMG_5616.jpegIMG_5615.jpegIMG_5614.jpegIMG_5613.jpeg
 

Daleandee

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Should my instrument panel be positioned perpendicular to my eyes or little bit down, so I don't see my own reflection.? If so how many degrees is recommended?
FWIW ... my panel, installed per the plans, has a 30º tilt that works well to help with a straight on view of the instruments. The only time this has been an issue is when flying with the sun directly behind me and the reflection off of the GPS can be distracting. When that happens I just toss a towel over it and fly the compass for a few minutes. ;)

Here's what I'm looking at:

1619289098021.png

I would have panel mounted the iFly but my wife gave it to me as a birthday gift after the panel was done ...
 

Rhino

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Eugene

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FWIW ... my panel, installed per the plans, has a 30º tilt that works well to help with a straight on view of the instruments. The only time this has been an issue is when flying with the sun directly behind me and the reflection off of the GPS can be distracting. When that happens I just toss a towel over it and fly the compass for a few minutes. ;)

Here's what I'm looking at:

View attachment 109867

I would have panel mounted the iFly but my wife gave it to me as a birthday gift after the panel was done ...
I was talking about distance and angle on picture below
C4886E6F-1ECB-4C96-B091-20253ED510DE.jpeg
 

Bigshu

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This is really difference between things that we like to have and things that we need to have. It is hard to justify $10,000 just for fun if you really don't need it. But on another hand everything we do in experimental aviation is just for fun.

Seems like yesterday Garmin 496 was best thing that ever happened to us. And we paid big price for this little unit. And this unit was doing for us everything that we possibly wanted at the time. Today we can get this rock solid unit used for only $500. It was so good to us yesterday. Why it's not good anymore today?

Or there is another alternative to iPad, iFly 640 with 7 inch screen that I just discovered. But I don't know nothing about it.

Looks like instruments is just like everything else in aviation - sky is our limit for how much we can spend on it.
Ifly makes a nice unit. Works with the UAvionics devices for ADS-B out. Highly recommended. If they did CAP search patterns like Garmin, they'd be my only choice.
 
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