BAN ALL DRONES! - Eric Zorn, Chicago Tribune

Discussion in 'Hangar Flying' started by Inverted Vantage, Aug 1, 2015.

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  1. Feb 9, 2016 #461

    Richard6

    Richard6

    Richard6

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    A little different story here:Fresno Co. Sheriff's helicopter almost hit by drone | News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News | KMPH



    Why wasn't Johnny obeying FAR § 91.119 Minimum safe altitudes: General.

    Except when necessary for takeoff or landing, no person may operate an aircraft below the following altitudes:

    (a) Anywhere. An altitude allowing, if a power unit fails, an emergency landing without undue hazard to persons or property on the surface.

    (b) Over congested areas. Over any congested area of a city, town, or settlement, or over any open air assembly of persons, an altitude of 1,000 feet above the highest obstacle within a horizontal radius of 2,000 feet of the aircraft.

    (c) Over other than congested areas. An altitude of 500 feet above the surface, except over open water or sparsely populated areas. In those cases, the aircraft may not be operated closer than 500 feet to any person, vessel, vehicle, or structure.

    (d) Helicopters, powered parachutes, and weight-shift-control aircraft. If the operation is conducted without hazard to persons or on the surface—

    (1) A helicopter may be operated at less than the minimums prescribed in paragraph (b) or (c) of this section, provided each person operating the helicopter complies with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters by the FAA; and

    (2) A powered parachute or weight-shift-control aircraft may be operated at less than the minimums prescribed in paragraph (c) of this section.

    According to the story on KMPH: Around noon Wednesday, the Fresno County Sheriff's Officer helicopter crew known as Eagle One was traveling to Shaver Lake to survey snow levels.

    Johnny should have been flying at over 1000 ft and most likely would have never even seen the drone.
     
  2. Feb 9, 2016 #462

    bmcj

    bmcj

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    You are citing the wrong rule. The applicable rule here would be paragraphs (d) and (d)(1). The Sheriff's helicopter was in compliance with the rules.
    The map below shows the approximate location (marked with a green-red-yellow bullseye NNE of FAT Airport:

    FAT chart.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2016
  3. Feb 9, 2016 #463

    Richard6

    Richard6

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    OK, but do we know if Johnny was following the FAA rule:

    (1) A helicopter may be operated at less than the minimums prescribed in paragraph (b) or (c) of this section, provided each person operating the helicopter complies with any routes or altitudes specifically prescribed for helicopters by the FAA; and

    Did you read the link I posted? They were flying to Shaver Lake to survey snow levels. Do you see any snow in the photos accompanying the story's? There was no reason for him to be flying at such a low altitude in that part of the flight.

    No. I'm guessing that he was buzzing somebody's house in the area, and like a lot of buzzing incidents, he almost ended up being very sorry.
     
  4. Feb 9, 2016 #464

    bmcj

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    At the point of conflict, he would have just cleared the airport traffic area, which means that the altitude he was flying at was either requested by him or assigned by ATC.

    It is typical for the law enforcement helos to patrol at 500-1,000 ft. I would guess that he maintained a low cruise through that area for 2 reasons...
    1) He was opting for a visual patrol enroute (part of his normal responsibilities);
    2) He was remaining clear of the Class C airspace above, which (in that area) is used to transition inbound and outbound jet airline flights to and from the north.
     
  5. Feb 9, 2016 #465

    BJC

    BJC

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  6. Feb 9, 2016 #466

    Richard6

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  7. Feb 9, 2016 #467

    bmcj

    bmcj

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    ...unless we watch or read any of the linked stories presented here in this thread.
     
  8. Feb 9, 2016 #468

    Himat

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    Are there a requirement for an altimeter in a small inhabited air vehicle?
    If not, how much error in judgment of altitude is within reasonable limits?

    Even with an onboard altimeter it is not that easy. Is it GPS altitude above chart ground level, difference in GPS altitude ground straight below flying position to flying height, barometric altitude or altitude measured by for example radar or laser that is the limit?
    Now if the ground is not completely level, what is the ground level?

    Both parties can be "complying" and still be on the same altitude if the measurement is not done the same way to the same reference points.
     
  9. Feb 10, 2016 #469

    BJC

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    That was my only post on the event.


    BJC
     
  10. Feb 10, 2016 #470

    12notes

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    Why does someone have to be lying? The helicopter was at 550 AGL, the drone went above it, there's no statements from the operator that deny this. The drone operator is at fault here.
     
  11. Feb 10, 2016 #471

    bmcj

    bmcj

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    Also, in other broadcasts here, it is said that the drone owner admitted to being in the wrong.
     
  12. Feb 10, 2016 #472

    choppergirl

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    Funny all this anti- drone talk being a threat to public safety, on the ground and in the air, when weaponized airplanes have been killing people since... 1914... over 100 years...

    Oh boy, when the public finds out about that... the days for airplanes... are numbered... :-(

    I'd post a related Youtube... but its so hard to pick... one of nuke bombs being dropped; carpet bombing by B-52's; Apache's spitting minigun lead; white phosphorous bombing (Hamburg, Dresden, modern day); fuel oil explosives; puff the magic dragons putting down lead every square meter; A-10 Warthogs spitting depleted uranium tank buster rounds; American WW2 aircraft over europe on a return to base free for all shoot anything that moved... not to mention, civilian GA crashes... like... airshow crashes, helicopter crashes, commercial jet disasters, GA pilot screw ups (Youtube is full of those)...

    Lets add up those numbers... and compare them to... drone fatalities. The scale is... millions killed by airplanes... versus... what can be counted on two hands... by civilian drones?

    After donating his aircraft design into the public domain for the good of humanity, Santos Dumont commited suicide from despair about the destructive use to which aviation was being put, seeing one plane shoot down another, and feeling guilty about his role as a pioneer of flight... hmmm

    All the laws and regulations in the world won't stop the military from using airplanes to kill each other... nor eliminate... accidents... it seems the drones that are doing the majority bulk of the killing are military ones... so maybe disparaging remarks should be focused towards those.

    *not a drone pilot*


     
  13. Feb 10, 2016 #473

    D Hillberg

    D Hillberg

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  14. Feb 10, 2016 #474

    BJC

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  15. Feb 10, 2016 #475

    D Hillberg

    D Hillberg

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    you are confusing warfare with public safety. Apples and Pineapples. Drones are not the problem---drone "pilots" are the problem uneducated in the standards used to navigate
    airspace used by the nonparticipating public. (passengers and ground based public)

    An air liner doesn't fly too well with a foded engine. and birds are bad enough going through your wind screen. kites on 1,000+ foot lines suck too.
    John Q Dumbsheite will make your day in a bad way------And those LiPo batteries make a nice bang on impact too.
     
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  16. Feb 10, 2016 #476

    12notes

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  17. Feb 10, 2016 #477

    BJC

    BJC

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    Yes, something is not working correctly.


    BJC
     
  18. Feb 11, 2016 #478

    mcrae0104

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    You should save your political commentary for another forum, and perhaps have more awareness of those whose ancestors you have insulted. Good luck with your Erector set.

    photo.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2016
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  19. Jan 17, 2017 #479

    pictsidhe

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    Over 400 feet AND less than 5 miles from an airport.
     
  20. Jan 17, 2017 #480

    Pops

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    What would be the regs for flying my RC on my grass field airport listed as (Private) on the Sectional ? Hard to believed I would be asking this question a few years ago. Whats next?
     

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