# Avid Flyer B model with old 503

Discussion in '2-Stroke Aircaft Engines' started by tsoftware, Apr 2, 2017.

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1. Apr 2, 2017

### tsoftware

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I recently acquired an Avid Flyer B model with no logs and a single ignition, water cooled 503 with an estimated 230 hours on it. The aircraft was built in 1989. I am guessing this is one of the early conversions and with no logs, I can't say that I trust it. Additionally, I am guessing that it is not worth overhauling it either.

With a B model cowl, I am guessing that I am best looking for another water cooled engine or replacing the cowl. Anyone have any experience with the B model with an air cooled engine?

I am further guessing that my best bet is for a Rotax 582, anyone have any experience with this conversion? If I have to buy everything, then that is going to get expensive quick. Any of the current 503 parts likely to make the transition?

Any other suggestions on engines?

TIA

2. Apr 2, 2017

### Dana

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503 is air cooled. If it's water cooled it's a 582 or maybe a 532. Unless there's something major wrong with it it's worth overhauling, see how it runs and go from there.

Dana

3. Apr 2, 2017

### tsoftware

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I will take your word for it. Current owner said that it was a 503...I had never seen a water cooled 503, but I also noted that it was single ignition, which really turned me off...don't think they ever made a single ignition 582, but I could be wrong. Could possibly be a 532? Guy is still fixing the trailer lights, so I don't have it home yet...can verify then. Either way, 503 and 532 are both out of production...this engine, with no logs, aircraft from 1989, seems prudent to tear it down. So, I am looking at a minimum of $1,000 to potentially over$2,000 plus shipping. These were my thoughts when I said I didn't think it was worth tearing down.

4. Apr 3, 2017

### Richard6

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I wouldn't jump to conclusions. Do you know the last time the engine ran?

Richard

5. Apr 3, 2017

### tsoftware

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We ran it for a few minutes while I was there. The person who currently has it has never flown it, but assured me that he has been ground running it at least monthly. He also mentioned, and I witnessed, that it is a cold natured on start. If I had some sort of history on the engine, I would be more likely to try and run it for a bit...once I get everything else where I want it and get it back legal to fly. The only thing that I know at the moment is that the aircraft is from year is 1989 with around 230 hours on the hobbs. I am still researching the aircraft and the engine to see what else I can find out.

6. Apr 3, 2017

### MikePousson

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Do you know of any damage history? As far as the Rotax engine, give Rotax Rick a call in Florida (Google him) and discuss your thoughts and get a ballpark price from him as to what it might cost to do an overhaul. I'd never go up with any engine that has no documentation with it, especially a two stroke.

7. Apr 3, 2017

### tsoftware

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None that I, or the FAA, know of. Rick was one of my thoughts as well, but a 503, for basically a 0 time overhaul, is over $2,000 and I still have a non-DCDI, points ignition with a big hole in the history. This very well may turn out to be a 532, as earlier suggested, which may be even more, presuming that either a 582 crank would work or an appropriate crank can be found. I would like to say that I will keep this plane forever, but I have to consider investment vs resale value. Additionally, I am not crazy about the single ignition. 8. Apr 3, 2017 ### lake_harley ### lake_harley #### Well-Known Member Joined: Jan 5, 2007 Messages: 954 Likes Received: 300 After you can verify the exact engine model another possible company to contact about a freshening/rebuild or just some advice is South Mississippi Light Aircraft. http://www.flysmla.com/ Morris did a rebuild of a 582 for me and my partner of a 582/Kitfox II, and I am quite pleased with the engine. I feel Morris did a thorough job of the rebuild without throwing unnecessary parts and cost at it. Lynn 9. Apr 3, 2017 ### tsoftware ### tsoftware #### Active Member Joined: Apr 2, 2017 Messages: 26 Likes Received: 1 Location: Harker Heights, Texas I have them on the list, as well as the guys up in Oregon. SMLA, was quoting a rate of$2,200+ for a 503, when I was looking at another aircraft. But once again, I am left with an engine with a huge hole in its maintenance history.

10. Apr 3, 2017

### TFF

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If its economics, what does a preferred firewall froward cost? Deciding good after bad money, if you could get what you want, what kind of flying you will do, is there upgrades to the old that make sense; lots of stuff to think about. I would give the original engine a go. At least send it to a shop to look inside. At least then you can sell it in good conscience. Just because it has logs does not mean its ok; I would still open up the other engine without some big assurances. If you do your job as a owner either will be OK.

11. Apr 3, 2017

### tsoftware

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Preferred, a 912, would be expensive and may not be feasible on the aircraft. On the other hand, there was a 582 with 12 hours on it that came up on Barnstormers a couple of days ago for \$2,000, but someone else beat me to it. A 582 transition may be somewhat economical, but what I don't know is, presuming the engine is a 503 or a 532, what other parts, such as the reduction gear, exhaust, radiator etc may be usable from the current engine to the next, or if it is indeed a full FWF swap. Or, perhaps there is a FWF solution that would be better and economical. I am more used to dealing with certified aircraft, so I am new to this market and looking for assistance and guidance.

This is a secondary plane for me and I want it to do the kind of flying that I could / would not use my Bonanza for and to build some tail-wheel time. I would not have considered this specific aircraft if I had not gotten it at a price that I believe that I can work with.

12. Apr 3, 2017

### Victor Bravo

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Get on the "avidfoxflyers" e-mail list and see what they have to say. Specifically you want to pay attention to my friend Joey Myers, aka C5engineer, who occasionally posts on this forum as well. Joey has a very very solid amount of experience flying the B model Avid with the Rotax powerplants. He flies his Avid into the back-country and always manages to fly back out, which should count for a LOT. He's good people too.

13. Apr 3, 2017

### tsoftware

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I signed up for an account with them on Saturday and verified my email address. Still waiting for them to approve my account so that I can post. Sent them an email using their "Contact" link this morning, but still waiting. If you have friends over there...you think you could ask them to bump someone so that I can get in?

Display name signed up with: TSoftware

Thanks

14. Apr 3, 2017

### Victor Bravo

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Just sent a PM to Joey through HBA. Hopefully he will be able to help you get it sorted out.

Be patient, every once in a while his nice old uncle asks him if he wants to take a jet airplane for a fun-filled vacation in the Middle East.

tsoftware likes this.
15. Apr 3, 2017

### bmcj

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Here's Joey's link on this site: http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/member.php?u=6400

In addition to here and avidfoxflyers, you will also find him on the Yahoo Avid Group.

In addition to Joey, another person very familiar with the B model is John out of Corona California on the Yahoo Avid Group (username Skypics).

16. Apr 4, 2017

### tsoftware

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Appreciate it...just ordered me a 582 with 8 hours and new seals in it and a Kiev 3 blade ground adjustable prop...so I guess I made my decision

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17. May 3, 2017

### C5Engineer

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Hey guys sorry I haven't logged in here for a while so I am just seeing this thread. tsoftware did you account ever get activated on Avid Fox Flyers?

18. May 4, 2017

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