Max Volume
Well-Known Member
probably the most important movie I'll make -
I flew in OPEN Pylon in 1972 and 1973. I flew my design. Low wing, 576 sq" of area. My 8% full symmetric airfoil. 3 lbs total weight. My caller was a good friend and RC modeler. I built the fuselages and George built the wings. We built 3 or 4 at the same time. He like to build wings. We practiced together several hours a week. Engines were Super Tiger G-61 racing engines on about 40% nitro if I remember correctly. I mixed my fuel 5 gas at a time. They very fast. Had to keep in practice to keep up with them.It’s been a while since I watched any of the Arnold videos, and must admit I didn’t watch them all. I was heavily involved with R/C pylon racing for two decades, and still have a passing interest now close to 50 years after the first one I entered. These events have engine and airframe specifications that must be adhered too much like IF1 does, so they boil down to aerodynamics and flying ability. Unlike full size, the g loading is much higher in the turns often exceeding 30 and may easily top 40 g’s.
In the winter of 1986 I started the construction of a semi-scale Stinger with a high aspect wing. While most Formula One models of that era had wingspans of 50” or so, this Stinger was set at 58.5” to achieve the required 450 sq. in. wing. It was finished up for the 1987 Nationals at Lincoln Nebraska, but radio failure caused it to stay on the ground at a very high speed for about a quarter mile. An earlier test flight showed it to be slightly tail heavy, so it had just a touch of down trim. The only time it actually got airborne was when it rolled across the tar strips that the summer heat pushed up between the concrete slabs. Each time the tar caused liftoff, the down trim slammed it back down on the main gear, and eventually the gear got flatten enough to kill the engine due to the prop strike. The only other people that took notice were the pattern flyers setting up about a quarter mile away. Some were climbing onto the top of their cars.
So the following year in 1988 we discovered just what high aspect wings really meant for Formula One. In RC, we fly 10 laps from a standing start four airplane in a heat. The point to point distance is 1320 feet with three pylons. Pylon one is 608 feet away, and two and three are 100 feet apart giving a relatively safe area for the pilots and callers plus flagmen. With the high aspect wing I could enter a turn with another airplane, but leave the turn 50-60 feet ahead. Ten laps, 20 turns, there were very few models that I couldn’t lap. I was usually taking off on the third or fourth flag, which meant I was spotting people often a half second which is a lot when the models cover about 250 feet/sec. I wasn’t much of a painter, and finish decided takeoff order in each heat. Well it took a couple years, but eventually everyone in the US adapted high aspect wings. Of course, at that time it was only being used in the US, but after our US FAI team won the top four places in the world’s competition, it swept through the rest of the world.
At the time, I lived in Sunnyvale California, my racing partner, engine guy, prop guy, and caller also lived in Sunnyvale working at Lockheed. Rather interesting is Stan Hall also lived in Sunnyvale and worked at Lockheed. His article published in September 1988 would have been 4 months after I won the Calcutta race at SLO in May by lapping 3 airplane in the final heat.
Now the the pressure Arnold rule. I absolutely agree with his conclusions, due to numerous Quickie 500 models I have built and raced in the ‘90’s. Quickies, as the name implies are simple boxes with a simple constant chord wing with a thick section. At least that was the original intent, they evolved into composite molded wings made in CNC molds, and became rather expensive at half a kilo buck. Along with the exposed engine and muffler, no fillets between the wing and fuselage are allowed. Over time it was determined generally high wing models were the fastest.
However I built a long series of designs where the fuselage width was straight from the firewall to the point of maximum camber of the lower wing surface, then expanded width so it met the width requirement at the trailing edge of the wing. This resulted in a much quieter airframe, especially in the turns and at a minimum at least 5+ mph increase in speed. At one contest during a dead calm test flight, It had a radar measure reading of 172 mph, while the next closest speed was in the lower 160’s and most were not breaking out of the 150 range. While some of that is due to advancing wingtips, light weight and careful alignment during construction, most is due to the expand width fuselage. With one of these designs, I managed to set the National Record in the late ‘90’s. I probably also hold the record for the most rule book changes to block various ideas and concepts over that two decades. They didn’t like the phenolic impregnated wood props that were so stiff and dense (they didn’t float in water), or the blade and a half prop that knocked four seconds off my time. Both added about a thousand rpm with all other things equal.
But there are so many pylon racing specific concepts still untested or under developed. Even entrained air inside of two stroke engines can add a lot of power. I apologize for the excessive length of this post.
After watching Max's latest video on Mike, I was also thinking again about the perennial wing placement question. Wing on top would seem the route to lowest interference drag, yet even in places where efficiency means $$ (airliners, etc) or trophies, the high wing isn't a popular choice. Obviously, a high wing is either not generally more efficient or other considerations win out (e.g. structural efficiency -->lower weight-->lower induced drag).Martin Hollmann claimed that the high wing configuration was the most efficient and mid wings the least, which makes sense, as you have little “nozzle effect” with a high wing and double the nozzle effect of a low wing with a midwing.
Martin Hollmann claimed that the high wing configuration was the most efficient and mid wings the least, which makes sense, as you have little “nozzle effect” with a high wing and double the nozzle effect of a low wing with a midwing.
Passengers don't like smacking their heads on the spar.After watching Max's latest video on Mike, I was also thinking again about the perennial wing placement question. Wing on top would seem the route to lowest interference drag, yet even in places where efficiency means $$ (airliners, etc) or trophies, the high wing isn't a popular choice. Obviously, a high wing is either not generally more efficient or other considerations win out (e.g. structural efficiency -->lower weight-->lower induced drag).
All the aerodynamic texts I have read show the mid wing to be the most efficient aerodynamically. But as others have pointed out the total packaging may have more impact on the overall efficiency. Spar placement without increased aerodynamic area is generally more difficult with a high wing. Mid wing can present cabin intrusion by the spar issues.Martin Hollmann claimed that the high wing configuration was the most efficient and mid wings the least, which makes sense, as you have little “nozzle effect” with a high wing and double the nozzle effect of a low wing with a midwing.
If the only criteria is wing efficiency, and, as you pointed out, it almost never is, mount the wing above the fuselage on a pylon.All the aerodynamic texts I have read show the mid wing to be the most efficient aerodynamically. But as others have pointed out the total packaging may have more impact on the overall efficiency.
Worked fine for the cat boat (and great way to get the props clear of spray) but I need an explanation of the "nozzle effect" as I am stuck back on poor man's area rule line of thinking. I have for the longest time regarded the Mini Imp as the ultimate expression of a 100HP single place as it neatly avoids the canopy issue and uses close to the constant increase in cross section of fuselage as Celera seems to do so effectively. In both cases, I am referring to real airplanes with really good results, not some theoretical or digital model. Just need to fully grasp the concepts to understand how and why.If the only criteria is wing efficiency, and, as you pointed out, it almost never is, mount the wing above the fuselage on a pylon. BJC
thanks, I will do just that.Just watch Mike’s vids on YT, he discusses the nozzle issue perfectly.
I read many times that the Corsair's gull wing design was partly done to both reduce drag at the root and eliminate the complexity of a long root faring. The second reason noted was that its propeller's diameter was massive and the wing configuration reduced the length and weight of the landing gear.All the aerodynamic texts I have read show the mid wing to be the most efficient aerodynamically. But as others have pointed out the total packaging may have more impact on the overall efficiency. Spar placement without increased aerodynamic area is generally more difficult with a high wing. Mid wing can present cabin intrusion by the spar issues.
I am not sure what this "nozzle effect" is but it sound like something that should be avoided for efficiency. Accelerating air uses up energy.
Both low and mid wing can have adverse pressure gradients on the wing's upper surface near the fuselage junction and this does require attention to prevent added drag in this area. Large fillets are a common method but add surface area. The miss named "poor mans area rule" is another attempt combating separation drag in the area of adverse pressure gradients by attempting to reduce the adverse pressure gradient. Just keeping the fuselage sides nearly parallel (or expanding) until the trailing edge of the wing is very effective and this (along with large fillets) were done on the AR-5.
Or eliminate the fuselage all together and have a flying wing.If the only criteria is wing efficiency, and, as you pointed out, it almost never is, mount the wing above the fuselage on a pylon.
BJC
IIRC, trade studies by DAR Corporation, discussed at Oshkosh, have shown that a conventional wing / fuselage / empennage can be more efficient than a canard or a flying wing.
BJC
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