Aero News Network Video - Terrible Raptor 1st Flight Review

[Topaz]

Maybe PM can develop a new mission statement and make the Raptor become a Ekranoplan (Ground Effect Vehicle). It might have enough useful load to carry 5 passengers and full fuel in this mission.

That's harsh.

According to both Peter's and Wasabi's videos on the subject, the only reason Wasabi did not fly it on their last visit was the airport did not have a long enough runway and not very good bail out options. They both stated the "must fix" items were addressed at that time. Peter moved the plane but did not bring them back. Since PM's first flight, I speculate there would be additional "Must Fix" items.

Ah, thank you. I hadn't heard that all the items were addressed.

 

[BJC]

Maybe PM can develop a new mission statement and make the Raptor become a Ekranoplan (Ground Effect Vehicle). It might have enough useful load to carry 5 passengers and full fuel in this mission.

BJC

 

[flyboy2160]

Some one hear that Peter returning ALL escrow deposits?

If this is off topic, just delete it:

Guys and Girls,

It's come to my attention that escrow.com is being forced by state rules to return deposits that have been in escrow for over 3 years in order to avoid the funds defaulting to the state. Obviously we don't want that to happen.

These deposits were initially meant to be a gauge of how much interest there was in the Raptor along with a way of holding a place in line. I think it's clear now that there is interest in the aircraft.

So, in order to not create a huge amount of work managing transfer of funds from escrow.com, the plan for if and when you receive a notice from escrow.com is to follow the directions to receive your refund. Then you simply keep those funds and Raptor will still maintain your place in line in our internal database.

If you truly want to cancel then contact escrow.com and cancel and let me know and I will remove you from the list.

I think this is a totally fair way of doing things. We won't need the escrow funds and you still keep your place in line.

As for the production plan, I am working with a group of folks on the West coast and things are looking promising for the plans we are making. I can't reveal any details as yet because nothing is confirmed but if we pull this off you will all be extremely happy. But before any of that can happen I need to get my current changes made and tested and get the first 40 hours flown off the airframe.

Thanks again for your continued support. No need to reply to this email as it's going out to well over a thousand people and I don't want to get inundated with replies.

Cheers,

--
Peter Muller
CEO
Raptor Aircraft LLC.
954-673-5960
www.raptor-aircraft.com

 

[BBerson]

Maybe PM can develop a new mission statement and make the Raptor become a Ekranoplan (Ground Effect Vehicle). It might have enough useful load to carry 5 passengers and full fuel in this mission.

The 'Caspian Sea Monster' rises from the grave

Is it a boat? Is it a plane? The Lun-class Ekranoplan, aka "The Caspian Sea Monster," is actually both. And now one of the most extraordinary Cold War flying machines ever built is about to enjoy a new lease on life.

www.cnn.com

Ha ha, all he needs is a taped on seaplane hull step for emergency landings.

 

[pictsidhe]

According to both Peter's and Wasabi's videos on the subject, the only reason Wasabi did not fly it on their last visit was the airport did not have a long enough runway and not very good bail out options. They both stated the "must fix" items were addressed at that time. Peter moved the plane but did not bring them back. Since PM's first flight, I speculate there would be additional "Must Fix" items.

Wasabi were not comfortable in flying the Raptor at Cherokee with its large number of dubious areas. I got the impression they would have tried outside tiger country, like at Valdosta. It seems that was a very wise move. If someone had flown it at Cherokee, it would at best have severely overheated before it got back on the ground. Of note is that Peter wasn't confident enough to fly it at Cherokee, either...

 

[231TC]

I think this is a totally fair way of doing things. We won't need the escrow funds and you still keep your place in line.

Well, that clears up the speculation about him seizing the escrow funds upon some mystery milestone. That was never a realistic scenario anyway. But who are these folks on the west coast? More software guys? Can't imagine they're aviation people.

Back to the technical aspects of the aircraft, he really seems to think he only has to implement and test a few minor mods and fly off 40 hours and then it'll be ready for production. At a point when he is still literally taping sheets of aluminum to it.

 

[Jet787]

I am pretty sure the test pilots agree the gear should not be retracted on initial test flights.
I don't know what test pilots do about the excess gear drag (if anything) on an underpowered design.

Not fly it.

 

[BJC]

But who are these folks on the west coast?

Perhaps ICON would like to put their unused production capability to use .....


BJC

 

[pictsidhe]

Well, that clears up the speculation about him seizing the escrow funds upon some mystery milestone. That was never a realistic scenario anyway. But who are these folks on the west coast? More software guys? Can't imagine they're aviation people.

Back to the technical aspects of the aircraft, he really seems to think he only has to implement and test a few minor mods and fly off 40 hours and then it'll be ready for production. At a point when he is still literally taping sheets of aluminum to it.

The elephant in the videos is the tiny detail that he has built a 5 seat aircraft that can only take 450lbs of people, fuel and baggage. That's not going to be fixed with a few kludges or hot air. At least one more prototype is needed before production.

 

[Voidhawk9]

'Fly off 40hrs' is a very inappropriate way of approaching the flight test phase for this machine, as well. It is a new design with a new engine etc. To be properly tested and proven should be in the hundreds of hours, not the legal minimum of 40.
My aircraft will be far less radical a departure from the 'known' than Raptor is, and I anticipate a test flying program that far exceeds 40hrs to thoroughly prove it out.

 

[flywheel1935]

These may be the guys PM is in discussion with ref production,???.


AeroInnovate is a community of innovators, entrepreneurs, investors, professionals, start-up junkies, analysts, and observers of the Aerospace and Aviation Innovation space worldwide. AeroInnovate also hosts a face to face gathering of the community in Oshkosh, WI, USA. AeroInnovate brings together these innovators & enablers to commercialize innovations in the aerospace/aviation industry (broadly defined) and to create an ongoing network.

 

[TarDevil]

Fly off 40hrs' is a very inappropriate way of approaching the flight test phase for this machine

He is currently being thus educated, as are his production investors.

 

[BBerson]

I don't think there is any 40 hour rule for the R&D prototype. If he has an agreement for that 40 hours with a "group" then that is a choice. I suppose the first customer could have his choice of engines and anything else.

 

[231TC]

These may be the guys PM is in discussion with ref production,???.

For the record, my question "who are these people?" was rhetorical. Probably not appropriate to speculate and name names without any real info.

 

[Topaz]

I don't think there is any 40 hour rule for the R&D prototype. If he has an agreement for that 40 hours with a "group" then that is a choice. I suppose the first customer could have his choice of engines and anything else.

Does the airworthiness certificate say "Experimental - Research & Development" or "Experimental - Amateur Built"?

Just because it's a prototype for a putative production model doesn't automatically put it in the former category.

 

[Topaz]

These may be the guys PM is in discussion with ref production,???.


AeroInnovate is a community of innovators, entrepreneurs, investors, professionals, start-up junkies, analysts, and observers of the Aerospace and Aviation Innovation space worldwide. AeroInnovate also hosts a face to face gathering of the community in Oshkosh, WI, USA. AeroInnovate brings together these innovators & enablers to commercialize innovations in the aerospace/aviation industry (broadly defined) and to create an ongoing network.

And what evidence brought you to this conclusion?

 

[Traskel]

I feel we should be giving PM more credit for his forward thinking despite his unwillingness to accept knowledgeable advice on many topics.

Setting aside his magical thinking for horsepower increases and his apparent , (and perhaps scary), lack of understanding of aeroelastic design and testing he is making a concerted effort to adapt a somewhat modern diesel engine design for aircraft use.

I believe this should be considered the holy grail of near-term experimental aircraft innovation. Fueling this potentially huge aircraft operating cost reduction, (pun intended..), are massive investments by the automotive industry to design remarkable diesel engines.

See 3.0L Duramax Turbo inline 6:

460 ft. Lbs of torque @ 1500 rpm..

Daring to explore modern GA engine applications and appropriately relegating the antiquated, certified aircraft IC's to the past is the forward thinking the industry needs.

He may not be the universally skilled engineer we dream of being but PM has vision and courage that should be appreciated if not congratulated. I just hope his lack of universal vision doesn't kill him.

 

[BJC]

Does the airworthiness certificate say "Experimental - Research & Development" or "Experimental - Amateur Built"?

R&D


BJC

 

[Topaz]

R&D


BJC

Thanks!

 

[Topaz]

Moderator Note: Okay, clearly the message hasn't gotten through. We've asked that you confine your discussion to the airplane, technologies, and events. To stop attacking the person. The last couple of pages is pretty much entirely "Peter this, Peter that, Peter is daring, Peter is a fool."

You were warned. Thread closed.