# 3D printing in the Homebuilt world.

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#### FritzW

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
...just a thread to collect all the 3D printing jibber jabber and to keep it off the respectable threads

#### Topaz

##### Super Moderator
Staff member
Log Member
Fritz, you mentioned your "... Evolution" 3D printer in the other thread, and I followed the link provided. That gets me to a ... page with... what, an inventory list and 3D printer files for some of the parts? I take it you need access to a 3D printer to obtain one of these 3D printers? And I missed the assembly and setup manual, if there is one.

For a newbie (RAW newbie), can you provide a little trailblazing into this very different world?

#### Hephaestus

##### Well-Known Member
Yeah that's a diy printer build. Likely someone offers a kit.

The railcore is offered in kit form similar design. Not so newbie friendly, but superb quality you won't get on much else.

Most people getting their feet wet are best served by an ender3 or similar. The prusas can be nice but they do tend to cost a premium due to some less common pieces... The creality lines has such a massive market share you can't really ignore them or the user groups behind them. Ender3 has that nice footprint, CR10S has the build area. (I've got a cr10S5 with almost 2' of build surface - it's awesome on big parts for real use)

#### FritzW

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
Ah, interesting - I was hoping you'd say railcore. I've got all the parts except that unobtainable 1515 extrusion for it. You might want to eyeball up it's Z though, it's way better than the cantilevered designs.

Did you play with the mmu2 at all? Keep hearing it's not quite there yet. Kinda like the new pallet, still not there yet... I've got dual e3d hotends on one printer just for pva supports, rarely use it now though. Really wouldn't mind if one of these multi material systems worked right
1515 is one of the most common extrusions, your having trouble finding it?

The MMU2 ("Multi Material Unit" ...for those who hate too many acronyms) was released before it was ready but they've worked most of the bugs out of it. Ours seems to be working fine. I haven't tried it with PVA yet (PVA= water soluable filament for support material).

Even if your not printing in multi color it's handy to have 5 rolls loaded and ready to go.

...the MMU

#### Jay Kempf

##### Curmudgeon in Training (CIT)
Wow! Missed this development. Amazing that this stuff remains open source.

#### FritzW

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
Fritz, you mentioned your "... Evolution" 3D printer in the other thread, and I followed the link provided. That gets me to a ... page with... what, an inventory list and 3D printer files for some of the parts? I take it you need access to a 3D printer to obtain one of these 3D printers? And I missed the assembly and setup manual, if there is one.

For a newbie (RAW newbie), can you provide a little trailblazing into this very different world?
The HyperCube Evolution (big brother of the original HyperCube) does need a 3D printer to print all the giblets. I've seen kits for the extrusions but I haven't looked for a printed parts kit. ...if you want to build a printer and you don't have a local friend with a printer, I'd bet a dozen or so HBA'ers would split the print list up and knock out a printed parts kit for you really quick.

The typical "flow" for a build like this to download the zip file (click the "Download All Files" button) then watch a bunch of HyperCube build videos on youtube. ...and follow some of the inevitable youtube rabbit holes about controller boards and slicers. (the rabbit holes will explain controller boards and slicers better than I can)

The electronics part can sound daunting but it's really pretty straight forward. It's easiest to just copy one of the youtube builds. Warning: "best controller board" debates on 3D printer forums are like "best glue" debates on the HBA, there's lots of passion and very little fact. The truth is just about any controller board will work fine.

If you spent an hour or two googleing "3D printer builds" and "CURA slicer" the mystery would be gone and you'd be a qualified internet expert on 3D printing

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#### Hephaestus

##### Well-Known Member
2020 is the most common extrusion 1515 is almost unobtainable in Canada (at least without insane customs and shipping costs). Noticed this morning that a makerslide distributor shows stock again. Maybe that's a non issue.

The guys I know who've run the MMU2 even as brand new are still not happy. I'd fricken love to have PETG, TPU (maybe tpe) and PVA in it. But I know that combination doesn't work well (we tried, temp variation usually gums up the nozzle, then the flexibles get funky during feeding)

There's a ton of closed source done too - there's a reason you'll never ever see a picture of my S5 posted online. It was rebuilt for a specific print I do and make fair money doing it. It's a competitive market and the way it's configured ensures I keep that work.

Maybe I should go back to why I said ender3 over the prusa... Similar idea to learning in a cub over a modern glass ship with autopilot. They've added the technology to make it easier to get going - but it complicates the hell out of troubleshooting. Learn to level your bed right you eliminate 99% of your printing issues - Chinese sourced hardware to "self level" works for a while - but it does fail, and you missed that important learning step of how to level and how to see when your bed is off or your X axis is out of level. The number of times I've helped experienced 3d printer owners resolve this - blows my mind... I dropped 99% of my fb 3d printing groups since this autolevel fad began, because it's all the same questions, it's always "no I have auto bed leveling it's level" not understanding that the failures show it's not level.

#### FritzW

Log Member
I'm not a super Prusa fan. They're good but not great and they're sure not worth (to me) the extra $600 just for the name (no offense to the Prusa fans, go with what floats your boat). And, like you said, they're really not very open source anymore. We've got$2000+ tied up in our chapter Prusa (granted, a lot of that was the MMU) and it doesn't print any better than my, very well tuned, Anet A8 (old Prusa clone) that cost $100. And the only problem I've ever had with the A8 was my own fault. I thought about getting an Ender kit but for the same money I can build a really nice, decked out HyperCube Evo with about 3x the build volume. We'll have to agree to disagree about using knock off hardware and boards. I like to spend my money as close to home as possible but I refuse to pay 1,000% markup just to join a brand name fanboy club. "Knock off's" run the gamut from total junk to brand name over runs. To say ALL knock off's are "xyz" is nonsense. Last edited: #### Jay Kempf ##### Curmudgeon in Training (CIT) Lifetime Supporter Creality CR10 is what I have 300x300y400z mm volume. Very well arranged machine. Very little putting it together, just a few bolts. Huge volume. I think I got it for$400 back a couple years now. Printed right out of the box. After a year I was a bit more demanding so I undid some things, tightened and calibrated, built an enclosure for ABS, put on a second Z axis stepper (not really necessary but cheap and easy).

I think I would get the same machine again but the latest controller.

#### gtae07

##### Well-Known Member
I have an Ender 3 and it's done well for my purposes so far. Under $200 shipped and prints better and more reliably than the$6000 Makerbot at work ever did. One airplane related use has been printing mockup avionics components.

I printed a few upgrades and otherwise it churns away. Was considering making throttle grip and maybe even a stick grip out of PETG or (if I can make it work) nylon.

#### FritzW

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
considering making throttle grip and maybe even a stick grip out of PETG or (if I can make it work) nylon
The flight sim guys are coming up with some neat stick grips... Some of the B8 grips look like they would work without much modification.

#### Hephaestus

##### Well-Known Member
Pretty sure for aircraft parts you want to eyeball the ABS-FR product lines.

I think I saw a fire rated ASA as well. Likely a better choice still.

@Jay Kempf - the old creality controllers still proving more reliable than the new pro ones so far... Wait a few iterative cycles... The 10S is pretty bomb proof once you've replaced the fan in the control box.

#### Jay Kempf

##### Curmudgeon in Training (CIT)
So far so good for me. I would like to not have to flash to do upgrades and rather just sell it and get new. But don't have any fancy needs at the moment. Just use it for the occasional prototyping task. I use my laser cutter more and my router more than that. But due to CAD work for clients I don't get to play with any of it as much as I would rather.

Not sure what I would do if I had to start again. The one thing I don't like is the hokey controllers. Would rather just have a straight up wireless working from the other networked computer in my shop. Same with all the machines. They all need to stand alone. Octopi works, just would rather have a windoze more commercial interface. Love Mach3 and Dropbox. Just awesome. But of course a dedicated PC on the router structure wireless networked in. The laser is simple. It holds 99 programs and can run autonomous after you upload. I put a wireless dongle on that and so you can just upload code from anywhere if you can see it.

The world has changed a lot in a few years. Sneaker nets... rememeber them?

#### FritzW

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
not very impressive strength ....
I think it's more about making it tough and stable. It's good stuff but it's a buger to print with.

#### Jay Kempf

##### Curmudgeon in Training (CIT)
They're making booger filament?

#### proppastie

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
Saw another about making a core for a cast hammer ...the layers had to be sanded and coated or else probably would not have released from the sand because the surface finish was so rough

#### FritzW

##### Well-Known Member
Log Member
The compression tester adapter is done. Tomorrow I'll see how much pressure it can take

#### ScaleBirdsScott

##### Well-Known Member
I've had 3D printed resin parts for a prototype paintball gun have volumes filled with up to about 300psi, above which point things started leaking around some loc-tite sealed plug, but never failed the plastic. I was able to get a fully printed set of clear internals for my design to evaluate function, where I initially assumed I'd only be able to handle modest 40-50psi regulated from the shop compressor to see if the air moved in the right order. In fact I was able to hook it up to a normal paintball tank and reg and actually go shoot rounds, so I was able to figure out that my design will shoot a ball at 280 fps when around 230-250psi

I would be very curious how well something like that printed plug works.