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Thread: PSRU

  1. #1
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    PSRU

    Hello folks..

    I work as a representative of a German manufacturing company in the province of Shandong China, manufacturing components for the aviations industries, from PSRUís, specialized engines components and other aviations items for the export market. The company has released 5 type of PSRU all of them reversed engineered to a superior standard of materials and engineering.

    PSRU Aero-11 Propeller Speed Reduction (2.55) Unit with helical gears (40 CR) supported by four ball-bearing races. The output shaft in an isostatic configuration with an oblique two crown sphere bearing. Clutch engages: 1900-2100 rpm. (sold separately ) Gears are EN39B case hardened to 60R, alloy case is CC601 heat treated to T6, output shaft is 4140. Weight: 9kg (20lbs). Rated up to 130 hp at 6500 rpm, and easily adaptable to any engine. Connection from clutch to primary gear through a grooved hub, made from 7075-T6 with hard anodized surface. Bell housings available for Suzuki, Webber 750 Ergal mass centrifugal dragging hub with hard oxide surfacing. Clutch shoes are of the sintered type with a bonded material high friction coefficient. FOB China USD 740.00 (minimum order)


    PSRU Aero 22 Is a single reduction gear drive (2.34) utilizing two helical cut gears mounted on shafting which is supported by ball bearings at each end. The torque is transmitted by a fully machined shaft which is driven by an extension of the flywheel bolts. This shaft drives a 3 bolt "star" assembly one piece machined to the shaft. The engine output torque is then passed to a non-metallic assembly Centaflex type (held by three bolts) In this assembly, that non-metallic unit is referred to as the torsional vibration damper. These gearboxes were designed in 2008 for aviation conversion of 2 and 4-stroke engines. Recommended for up to 170HP engines. It is possible to use these gearboxes for both (tractor and pusher) layouts, install it up, down and any degrees left or right on the bell housing. The body consists of 2 bolted down parts: 1) gearbox with the gear and oil inside and damper housing ,mount plate (bell housing) and crank-damper coupler. The gearbox life-time is 1000-2500 hours (depends on the engine power and the prop moment of inertia). Gears are EN39B case hardened to 60R, alloy case is CC601 heat treated to T6, output shaft is 4140.Bell housings available for Suzuki, Subaru, Webber 750 FOB China USD 980.00 (minimum order )

    PSRU AeroFlight33 AeroFlight redrives are a self-contained, oil bath, helical cut gear to gear, prop speed reduction unit. 2.2, to 1 ratios and are Centaflex driven for harmonics. Rotation is counterclockwise and prop flanges come in 4", SAE 1 & 2 with drive lugs. This box are offered in 190hp versions for Subaru EJ 25 SOHC and DOHC. Gears are EN39B case hardened to 60R, alloy case is CC601 heat treated to T6, output shaft is 4140.Bell housings available for EJ series Subaru FOB China USD 1200.00 (minimum order )

    All PSRUís are entirely made by a German engineering company based in the Province of Shandon China ,specializing in the manufacturing of Aircraft components for the international market. All reduction boxes are fully Dyno tested with TUV and ISO certificates and made under the strict supervisions of German technicians and engineers. All PSRU are fully warranted for a period of 12 Months from the moment of operational installation.

    For more information please donít hesitate to ask any question, all questions and emails will be promptly answered alternatively follow this tread, very well discussed

    http://www.rotaryforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27304



    Respectfully
    Albert Briceno

    psruaustralia@yahoo.com

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    Re: PSRU

    Do you have one that would take 400 hp and bolt to a 20b rotary?

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    Re: PSRU

    Quote Originally Posted by oneturboneeded View Post
    Do you have one that would take 400 hp and bolt to a 20b rotary?

    Hello

    We have a PSRU, the AeroFlight 44 , titanium gears and a special Magnesium composition capable of 400hp+ but we have developed it for Subaru engines only. If we had a Rotary engine and the market for it, of course we would be interested in to developing a bell housing. The biggest problem into developing bell housing for exotic engines , is that we donít know the engine torsional excitation and before we release any product on the markets this issues have to be addressed.

    Thanks
    Albert

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    Registered User BoeveP51's Avatar
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    Re: PSRU

    Have you done any work interfacing to a Chevy V8/LS series?

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    Re: PSRU

    I have a 13b I can lend to the cause but I haven't built my 20b yet

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    Re: PSRU

    Bad thing about a rotary is alot of torsional vibration.

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    Registered User Autodidact's Avatar
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    Re: PSRU

    I am aware of these china copies, there is not much I can do to stop them. The price of a New Zealand made Autoflight gearboxes reflects the cost of development in the first place where the cost of a "china gearbox" does not. This is a niche market and Autoflight manufactures these units because we are involved in gyro aviation and enjoy it. You will find we are the only manufacturer supplying a dedicated offset down unit for the gyro industry. If this copying continues there will be no reason continue designing new units for new engines just to have them stolen and copied. This rubbish about a German company building these units in china is untrue. You will see the picture of the "Aeroflight " ( even climbing in on my name! ) gearbox in their advertising is in fact an Autoflight gearbox not even their own! I know where this gearbox was taken from.
    I have a document the copiers sent me telling me so, I will post this shortly.
    They are rubbish and you will get what you paid for, remember that!
    If these guys are so clever why don't they design their own unit? They don't have the ability!

    Neil Hintz
    Autoflight Ltd
    New Zealand ( not china )
    ...
    "Milk cures wing dope poisoning."

    ó Flying and Glider Manual

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    Re: PSRU

    Quote Originally Posted by oneturboneeded View Post
    Bad thing about a rotary is alot of torsional vibration.
    Hi

    This would be interesting but we are in China. Again, who can we justify a few bell housing for an engine you admit has a Ďlot torsional vibrationsí meaning we would have to redesign our oil pressure filled flywheel and couplings to a smaller as opposed to Subaru engines star all the testing all over. The costs, of this even in China is no panacea. To be honest to you , I donít even know what the crankshaft looks like on the Rotary engines. With this would like to answer to BoeverP51, no.. That is totally out of our manufacturing scope .

    Thanks
    Albert

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    Re: PSRU

    Quote Originally Posted by Autodidact View Post
    ...

    Originally Posted by Neil Hintz
    Heron, The Autoflight gearbox is superior to other designs as well as using first class materials, the input shaft design is novel. It was patentable when I first designed this system but didn't because it would add cost and this is a small niche market, hell who would bother copying it. There is no loose joint from the crank to the output shaft to move or fret only gear clearance. The rubber drive takes care of the "normal" engine pulses. There would be over 400 units out " doing the business " over five years ( Autoflight Ltd ). So it would seem it is worth copying, I would have at least thought these people would have contacted me to discuss a license deal. As you will see from another post here ( where the china copiers are copying the Zenon ) they actively hid from Autoflight hoping to get to the market before I noticed. We don't have snakes in NZ but china does. Interesting enough there are rules about selling direct copies in Australia and in NZ, patented or not. I am using Trade and Enterprise to investigate having these copies stopped from sale in these countries. In the future I will now have to look into protecting my intellectual property.

    The SCEO (BMW clone) was unveiled in 2005 and is powered by a range of Mitsubishi engines. Sure, the SCEO is a reversed engineering inspired by a previous generation BMW X5 but itís a lot of car for a little money in China, and also, quite possibly the most important part, SCEO drivers manage to drive their SUVís much better than their X5 driving equivalents. This is good news for consumers, bringing the prospect of half-price vehicles. BWM lost the court case, both in patent and intellectual property in Europe and joined the Chinese. Currently the SCEO is sold thought-out Europe, Russia, and all other Asian countries. Despite German technology, VW in Brasil made some incredible innovations on a Ty3 VW , later all adopted by the German manufacturer.

    But letís put things in perspective, claiming the use of superior material without disclosing the nature of your material is a technical aberration, we have disclosed the material, hardness and design rules were used in the gears and castings . Gears are gears, and therefore not patentable nor do they have any intellectual right attached to it. The original boxes (3 of them) were 3D in the States and there was a measure disparity at the base of the box in relation to its cover, we have corrected this problem making it totally uniform. We have increased the internal size of the final output shaft and slightly increased the size of the main gear. Initially we tested the box using equidistant pulses over one shaft revolution and it showed a fair amount of vibrations, the manufacturer not being happy with the results tested the box with propeller with the Runge-Kutta method, using a pressure oil filled flywheel to the box and was happy to inform 95% of the torsional vibrations were rectified. We are not using the SKF KMFE8 main shaft bearing retainer, as the original is modified and not in the specifications by SKF. Destructively tested The AeroFlight 33, showed some hair line cracks at the upper casing and sharing of the pins at the main shaft locating the flexible coupling. The all new AeroFlight 44Tand soon to be released, has all gears made in Titanium and, high-pressured injected castings and rated up to 400HP!

    Does reverse engineering infringe an ownerís copyright? The answer is no. Generally, the Copyright Act prohibits copying someone elseís intellectual property, including software code. However, consider the legislative purpose of the Copyright Actóthe act was designed to encourage the free flow of ideas. To protect your business from claims of copyright infringement, you will need to demonstrate that you actually engineered the property. The NZTE has no authority to stop sales of any reversed engineering items.

    The final stage of the reverse engineering process is the introduction of a new product into the marketplace. These new products are often innovations of the original product with competitive designs, features, or capabilities. These products may also be adaptations of the original product for use with other integrated systems. Copyright does not cover ideas, processes, procedures, systems, or methods of operation nor does prevent the sales of it in any part of the world.

    Lastly, your published email at the board, shows clearly it was never concealed to you the boxes were reversed engineered, subsequent emails to you with an open invitation to join as equal using our vastly superior engineering capabilities, manufacturing processes and investments and with your excellent mechanical expertise in this venture and for the benefit not only for us, but capable to deliver to the consumer excellent products with an unique and powerful brand* name well established around the world at a cheaper rate. Please consider all this before the snakes start biting.

    Thanks
    Albert

    Adendum:
    Addressed to Heron: There is no loose joint from the crank to the output shaft to move or fret only gear clearance.
    This correct, with all the copious amount of 3M (thread lockers for securing nuts and bolt) and the looking nut SKF KMFE8, that the shaft as mentioned in the previous post could have ever moved, except for a shaft failure itself or at some other unspecified reasons or vibrations.

  10. #10
    Registered User Mac790's Avatar
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    Re: PSRU

    Reverse engineering is such a great term with long tradition, everybody heard about Russian Tu-4 (reverse engineered B-29 ).

    Funny that you guys don't have PSRU for Rotary and V8 engines, why don't you use reverse engineering ? piece of cake.

    Speaking about chinese '"quality", everybody knows about my plugs, I was using a lot of waterproof sandpaper, take a look at those pixs, pix1 Made in China "waterproof" sandpaper after 5 min work, pix2 Made in Poland waterproof sandpaper after 1h work, any comments?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1946
    Sure, the SCEO is a reversed engineering inspired by a previous generation BMW X5 but it’s a lot of car for a little money in China... This is good news for consumers, bringing the prospect of half-price vehicles.

    Love those chinese cars


    Seb
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails PSRU-img_1489.jpg   PSRU-img_1493.jpg  
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    "Time, training, training, training and more training is the key to any success."
    Francis "Gabby" Gabreski

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    Re: PSRU

    Quote Originally Posted by Mac790 View Post
    Reverse engineering is such a great term with long tradition, everybody heard about Russian Tu-4 (reverse engineered B-29 ).

    Funny that you guys don't have PSRU for Rotary and V8 engines, why don't you use reverse engineering ? piece of cake.

    Speaking about chinese '"quality", everybody knows about my plugs, I was using a lot of waterproof sandpaper, take a look at those pixs, pix1 Made in China "waterproof" sandpaper after 5 min work, pix2 Made in Poland waterproof sandpaper after 1h work, any comments?


    YouTube - Chinese car crash test failure
    Love those chinese cars


    Seb

    Hi Seb
    I agree with you, some of the Chinese sand paper could be used as toilet paper too, smooth as glass, but why you blame the Chinese about it..? It was obviously imported in to Poland and the importer dint care about quality rather getting a cheaper products on the marked thus beating the opposition. This appears unfortunately, what's happed with your spark plugs too.

    I don’t think it would be very funny making something of a very limited market, not good business practice making pieces of cakes.

    In regards of cars made in China, and despite all short comings, they manage to outsell the biggest car manufactures in Europe and the US, for two consecutive years. Something must be wrong the dummy survived.

    Thanks
    Albert

  12. #12
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    Re: PSRU

    Albert,
    Quote Originally Posted by 1946
    but why you blame the Chinese about it..?
    It's very simple, I don't like Chinese products, but unfortunately it's really hard to buy non Chinese stuff nowadays ( and it makes me really unhappy), for example my father bought about 20 years ago Bosch jigsaw (Made in Germany), still works beautifully, try to buy Made in China one. A lot of good companies here went bankrupt, and it's hard to get good products, even that %^&% sandpaper is Chinese, I have to go 5 miles to get proper sandpaper.

    ...what's happed with your spark plugs too.
    I was talking about different plugs, you know plugs, molds, composites, etc.

    they manage to outsell the biggest car manufactures in Europe and the US, for two consecutive years.
    I'm not surprised at all, with market like that (1,338,612,968 people) .

    Speaking about your PSRU please show us flying product.

    Seb
    Last edited by Mac790; October 2nd, 2010 at 05:48 PM.
    Amor Patriae Nostra Lex

    "Time, training, training, training and more training is the key to any success."
    Francis "Gabby" Gabreski

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    Re: PSRU

    Quote Originally Posted by Mac790 View Post
    Albert,

    It's very simple, I don't like Chinese products, but unfortunately it's really hard to buy non Chinese stuff nowadays ( and it makes me really unhappy), for example my father bought about 20 years ago Bosch jigsaw (Made in Germany), still works beautifully, try to buy Made in China one. A lot of good companies here went bankrupt, and it's hard to get good products, even that %^&% sandpaper is Chinese, I have to go 5 miles to get proper sandpaper.


    I was talking about different plugs, you know plugs, molds, composites, etc.


    I'm not surprised at all, with market like that (1,338,612,968 people) .

    Speaking about your PSRU please show us flying product.

    Seb

    Sep
    I canít change your perception of Chinese products, free market, consumer choices. These PSRU are made in Poland http://www.aerotech-poland.com I am sure you will be satisfied with them, and would support the local industries. All the best.
    Thanks
    Albert

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    Re: PSRU

    seriously. show us a number of flying examples with plenty of hours on them, and we can all have a look at the results. Average car buyers are not discerning at all beyond pretty curves and a cd player that talks to them. Aircraft builders are too smart to fall for that kind of crap.

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    Re: PSRU

    Quote Originally Posted by shafferpilot View Post
    seriously. show us a number of flying examples with plenty of hours on them, and we can all have a look at the results. Average car buyers are not discerning at all beyond pretty curves and a cd player that talks to them. Aircraft builders are too smart to fall for that kind of crap.

    The reversed engineering PSRU come from previously proven boxes in many applications and with very good records in experimental aircrafts and gyrocopters, having said that, it doesn’t mean there is not a room for improvements and since a very convenient labour rate in China, the saving of it can be passed to experimental builder. Revering engineering’s is very expensive and time consuming, one has to re-engineer the pitfalls of the original manufactures, as an example, the Russian SPG-2 (now Aero22) has very poor castings and welded gear components, with the Aero 22 all this issues have been rectified.

    The original box, now the AeroFlight33 was delivered with a flimsy torque plate with a welded on ring gear on, and reportedly breaking main shaft due to extreme vibrations and other issues, gaining a open warnings by an Australian authority about problems with the bearings, this was rectified too, now delivered with a specially made flywheel, superior casting and materials used in the gear manufacturing’s, test now have proved the torsional excitation are now 95% reduced.


    Good news are the AeroFlight 33 has been in trail service since Feb 2008 and currently in operations with a Shandong aircraft maker with over 4000hr in flight service with a Subaru EJ225 N/A VTC detuned to 190Hp engine, and a 3 blade electric MT-CS propeller with electric governor.

    There is a huge market in China for aviation reduction boxes for the Chinese aircraft industries, being made in China, the boxes must have not equal but better standards of to pass Chinese Airworthy Certification and unknown to many experimental aircraft builders in the US that in accordance with the U.S./People’s Republic of China Bilateral Airworthiness Agreement and the associated Schedule of Implementation Procedures, airworthiness certification of aeronautical products is reciprocally accepted. If it is good for the goose it must be good for the gander.

    I know too, the experimental aircraft builders are way smart to, as you say, no to buy crap.

    Thanks
    Albert

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