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Thread: Hello from SW MO

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    Hello from SW MO

    recently medically retired from working on BlackHawks & Chinooks (And G.A. previous to that). When other kids were getting working permits for McDonalds, I was bucking rivets in Cessnas with numb fingers for $2.50\hr.

    I've got an exploratory project bouncing around the noggin. "Exploratory" because I have a shovel ready aviation-unrelated (music studio building) project in front of it.

    In wondering why you never see canard gliders. Seems to me, the design would be perfect, with the appropriate wing & canard design (eventually, to be self-launching). Alas, there must be SOME reason you don't see them!

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    Registered User BJC's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    Welcome to HBA, the best sport aviation place on the www.

    Rutan tried it with this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rutan_Solitaire

    The limitations of the canard configuration have been widely discussed here. Use the advanced search to find those threads.


    BJC

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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    Welcome to the forums!

    Aspect ratio of the lifting system is one key parameter for soaring performance. For a canard aircraft, the canard itself is included with the wing in that "lifting system." Aspect ratio is defined as span squared divided by total area (b^2/A), so a canard design will always be at a disadvantage compared to "conventional" design.

    The same math applies to biplanes, which is why you don't see high-performance biplane gliders, either.
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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    Quote Originally Posted by XtremeBudgetMusician View Post
    In wondering why you never see canard gliders.
    Alas, there must be SOME reason you don't see them!
    Same reason you don't see a screen door on a submarine! Just not the optimum solution!
    “The only difference between reality and fiction is that fiction needs to be credible.” - Mark Twain

    “If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull$hi+.” ― W.C. Fields

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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    Welcome to the HBA forum from the Southeast part of Missouri, near Cape Girardeau. Your question is way beyond me so I'll let the others guide you. I do well to follow detailed plans, much less go into "exploration" mode on a project.

    Lynn

    Topaz....I hate to barge into the welcome, but I have a question about your formula. "Aspect ratio is defined as span squared divided by total area (b^2/A), so a canard design will always be at a disadvantage compared to "conventional" design. The same math applies to biplanes, which is why you don't see high-performance biplane gliders, either"

    When applying the formula for aspect ratio on a biplane, would it be the span of one wing squared divided by the area of one wing, or would the span squared of one wing be divided by the total area of both wings?
    Last edited by lake_harley; December 11th, 2016 at 07:31 PM.

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    Registered User pwood66889's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    Welcome to HBA, X. As stated, best forum on the web.
    I worked on the UH-60 myself; now on UH-72.

    Percy in SE Bama

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    Registered User bmcj's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    The other issue of the canard is that the canard should stall first to prevent the main (rear) wing from stalling. This means that you will never be able to fly your main wing at the max coefficient of lift (Cl, the peak of the lift/drag curve just before the stall). A lot of soaring flight depends on getting the max lift coefficient to get the best flight results, and a properly designed canard can never reach that full Cl on the main wing.

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    Registered User Victor Bravo's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from SW MO

    Somewhere else on this forum I posted an anecdote about once sharing a thermal with the Solitaire canard glider. To summarize what others have mentioned already, that configuration has built-in inefficiencies that are unacceptable for the typical glider use.

    There was another really interesting canard glider from Switzerland or somewhere nearby, which had the fuselage suspended from the wing with huge airfoiled V struts, and the canard way the heck out in front. Really exotic and futuristic looking. Didn't work well enough to achieve its mission.
    "Everything in this book may be wrong."
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