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Thread: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

  1. #31
    Registered User Holtzy3's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Quote Originally Posted by djschwartz View Post
    The Pitts and the WAR FW190 would be very different aircraft. The FW190 is not anything close to the same level of aerobatic aircraft as the Pitts is, and their handling characteristics will be quite different.
    ...ok, then what aircraft would you propose would be similar, a citabria maybe? its kinda closer... i cant think of any other aircraft off the top of my head that would work.

  2. #32
    TFF
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Just remember that everyone here has as much interest in aircraft and flying as you do; no one is trying to steer you wrong. Almost everyone wants a fighter; the scaled down versions do not make good airplanes if your intent is trying to duplicate anything but looks. If you want a flier that is small, build a Soneri; build a Pitts or a One Design if you want something higher performance. You could buy a project for $3-4K which is head start. 2000 hrs is equal to 8 hrs a day Monday-Friday for 50 weeks; equal to a full time job by the IRS. That does not include learning how to weld or making jigs or any task you dont know how to do right away.
    Try to find someone who will train PPL in a tailwheel but dont give away Cessna time; the only time to be snooty about an airplane is when you have one of each kind. If you really want to know how to fly well, start in gliders. Even jet guys respect what goes into flying a glider. If your plan is to save money by building a plane, stop. It does not work that way; you may be able to spend a little here and a little there until it is done, but it cost the same to build as buy. Buying means flying right away, or money can be put to lessons.

  3. #33
    Registered User djschwartz's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Quote Originally Posted by Holtzy3 View Post
    ...ok, then what aircraft would you propose would be similar, a citabria maybe? its kinda closer... i cant think of any other aircraft off the top of my head that would work.
    For a certified aircraft you can rent and get dual in the best I could suggest would be an Extra 200 or 300. Both will be much more powerful and responsive than the WAR FW190. But they are monoplanes that will give you a somewhat similar sight picture over the nose and probably have a somewhat similar approach profile. But you're right that there is nothing you can get that is really close enough to be considered complete preparation. That's why you'll need quite a bit of experience under your belt before you fly one. You need to be good enough to be a bit of a test pilot, to be able to figure it out as you first try to fly it. This is pretty much true for any single seat aircraft that doesn't have a closely related two seat counterpart.

    Dave

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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    I think we all appreiate your excitement and focus regardless if you're calculating your build time
    correctly - but I believe someone should really mention that to 'ram-rod' your training to force your
    early flight training into your newly built homebuilt does not promote safety in aviation.

    Being in a 'hurry' is never smart in an aircraft; i believe the safest path for both your personal safety,
    and to prevent accidentally bending any parts due to your early experience levels, would be to
    follow more traditional training methods and use a 'student-friendly' aircraft like 152/172 until you
    develop your primary flight skills, have someone else with flight testing experience fly off your first
    10-20 hours of flight time for the Experimental aircraft once complete, and then get transition
    training for that aircraft type.

  5. #35
    Registered User Holtzy3's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    I really wish I did have the money to buy a project and I would love that but I just don't. I have the money for my ppl already set aside so that's not really my problem. My problem is I don't have the money to go out and build or buy a one design or a Pitts. I do like the sonerai but again I can't find any good priced projects around aside from the yellow one on barnstormers but I just don't have the money to drop on an aircraft all at once. If I already had my solo and ppl I'd probly be flying a sonerai or something right now but I really we challenge and reward of building. And I've come to my senses. By the time the aircraft is done I know I'll have somewhere around 25ish hours and have my solo and be well on my way to my full ppl. Probably even more than that.

  6. #36
    Registered User Holtzy3's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    What is transition training exactly? That's what I was planning to do though. I plan to train in either a diva skylark or 172 I don't know which one yet but what is transition training and do you have your ppl to do it or can you be a student pilot

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    Moderator Dana's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    The excmption for "transition training" applies in situations where the instructor owns or otherwise provides the aircraft being used... it comes out of the prohibition of using experimental aircraft for commercial operations. For example, I believe the Lancair factory provides transition training in their aircraft for builders building one, but they would not be able to use the aircraft for training toward any certificate. When the student owns the aircraft it's different; then it's not "commercial use", so a student pilot could take primary flight instruction in an experimental he owns (if he can find a willing instructor).

    As for a solo signoff in a single seater, it would depend on the instructor... and the student. There are students who have grown up around the airport "family" and flown for years, often with a CFI parent, so the "official" instruction is just a formality; I have heard of such kids soloing a Pitts and even a P-51 on their 16th birthday... but obviously that's rare. In your situation, it's less likely... even extremely unlikely unless the 40 hours were already flown off (who's going to do that?), the instructor was very confident in your piloting ability, and the instructor had himself flown your plane to determine if it's "similar". All unlikely.

    Better not to push things, take your time (both in building and learning to fly), and do it right.

    -Dana

    I'm not saying let's go kill all the stupid people... I'm just saying let's remove all the warning labels and let the problem sort itself out.

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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    If you want to build no matter what, build a Pitts. It might be a little tiger, but it is easy to build and you can build it in small incriments. Start with wing ribs; $300 and you can have all the materials for the ribs. There is about 20 to make so that takes a while. Buy spars, start putting it together, buy leading edges and drag/ aitidrag wires. The plane can be built in these small steps as you have money. Tubing for the fuselage is about $1000 and it will tae a while to turn it into airplane parts. I can go on but that is what all of us do unless you can buy a RV kit.

  9. #39
    Registered User Holtzy3's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Yeah the Pitts is totally out of ny price range really because the engine

  10. #40
    Registered User PTAirco's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Quote Originally Posted by Holtzy3 View Post
    Yeah the Pitts is totally out of ny price range really because the engine
    Not to mention the cost of flying wires!

    When I was young(er) , I was dead set on designing, and building my own biplane and then learning to fly in it. No, I am not kidding. I saw no point in having a license without something to fly and I wanted to fly nothing apart from "cool" airplanes. Particularly my own. In hindsight it was foolish - no matter how optimistic you are and diligently you work, this stuff takes a lot of time. A LOT. Get your license first, any way you can, stop worrying about paying for the extra few hours in a rented airplane. When you have it in your pocket, it's a great incentive to work at your airplane and perhaps in the meantime you can find somebody who can provide some training in something similar for when you're ready to fly your own.
    "Aeronautical engineering is highly educated guessing, worked out to five decimal places. Fred Lindsley, Airspeed."

  11. #41
    Registered User djschwartz's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Quote Originally Posted by Holtzy3 View Post
    What is transition training exactly? That's what I was planning to do though. I plan to train in either a diva skylark or 172 I don't know which one yet but what is transition training and do you have your ppl to do it or can you be a student pilot
    "Transition Training" as used by the FAA for this specific case means training to familiarize a new owner or builder of an experimental aircraft with its flying characteristics. It is not required, if you buy or build a homebuilt that is in the category and class you are rated for, and for which you have any necessary endorsements or ratings, you can fly it. But it is becoming highly recommended by the major kit vendors who are trying to help reduce accident rates.

    But as the other posters have said, the FAA has ruled that homebuilts cannot be used to give dual instruction to anyone other than the owner of the aircraft; so, they made an exception to allow a homebuilt to be used for giving "transition training" to some one other than the owner who is building or buying that type of aircraft. Vans and some other big kit makers offer this training at their factories using company planes.

    To get "transition training" you must already be rated to fly that aircraft, and of course, it must be a two seat or more aircraft. You cannot do "transition training" in a single seat aircraft.

    Dave

  12. #42
    Registered User djschwartz's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Quote Originally Posted by Holtzy3 View Post
    ... I plan to train in either a diva skylark or 172 ...
    Since your goal is to build and fly fun little homebuilt taildraggers, learning to fly in a taildragger would be best if you can find a way to do it. It will take you a lot longer to solo that way; but, your flying skills will be better. And you won't have to "unlearn" habits formed in the very docile and sluggish tricycle gear trainer.

    But don't sweat it if there isn't a taildragger and instructor readily available, it's certainly possible to make the transition later. Just be prepared to go back to being a beginner student again for at least a few hours when you start to make that transition.

    Dave

  13. #43
    Registered User Holtzy3's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Yeah I'm starting to realize how long this will take to build but like I said I want a challenge and reward of building. So I'm going to take this head on I don't care how long it takes. I'll figure out all the regs when its done ahah

  14. #44
    Registered User Holtzy3's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Well I was advised by someone who is huge in aviation he raced in reno, flew 747s and currently flies l-39s and he said its not a good idea and said to build a 2 seat aircraft so new forum now

  15. #45
    Registered User Dan Thomas's Avatar
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    Re: do i need a tailwheel endorsment to fly a single seat experimental td

    Quote Originally Posted by djschwartz View Post
    Since your goal is to build and fly fun little homebuilt taildraggers, learning to fly in a taildragger would be best if you can find a way to do it. It will take you a lot longer to solo that way; but, your flying skills will be better. And you won't have to "unlearn" habits formed in the very docile and sluggish tricycle gear trainer.
    My experience with soloing ab initio students in both trikes (150s and 172s) and taildraggers (Champs and Citabrias): It took no longer to solo the taildragger than the trike. It was interesting to see: the taildragger student mastered the thing easily enough, because he had to use his feet from the start and didn't develop the lazy-feet syndrome typical of the trike pilot. The 50-hour trike PPL took another 5-10 hours to solo the taildragger, mostly because he had to start using those feet that had been loafing along all this time. The 50-hour taildragger PPL found the trike too easy and boring after an hour or two, and much of that time was spent learning to use the wider array of instruments and radios, not flying the airplane (other than use of flaps).

    Dan

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