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Thread: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

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    Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    O.K. I understand that the FAA has, in effect, "BANNED" the Criquet "Storch" LSA. My understanding is that the fuselage was manufactured in South America, imported into the U.S. and the LSA finished in Florida.

    The FAA did an "Audit?" of the company in Florida and came out with the ruling that in the future, no Air Worthiness Certificates would issued for Criquets. In the meantime, the FAA DID NOT revoke the Air Worthiness certificate of the 3 Criquet Storches now flying.

    Then the FAA won't comment ON WHY the Criquets have been banned.

    MY QUESTION:

    If I purchase a set of plans for the Pazmany PL-9 Stork and build such an aircraft, following all FAA rules, etc...would the FAA approve it for flight?

    The Pazmany PL-9 is, in effect, identical to the banned Criquet Storch.

    ALSO......................................

    Is anyone familiar with ANY "Safety Issues" with the Pazmany PL-9 Stork?

    THANKS!!!!!

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    Registered User bmcj's Avatar
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    You are comparing LSA with EAB (not even ELSA). I don't have any specific knowledge of this case, but suspect the that perhaps the Criquet might not meet certain standards of LSA certification (under the international joint agreements. If that is the case, it may be safety related or purely an administrative issue.

    The pans built Pazmany does not have to meet any joint consensus standards since it falls under the EAB (Experimental Amateur Built) rules. Generally, I think you have nothing to worry about, though I would still try to find out if there was a flaw in the design that drove this (like you are doing here)... better safe than sorry.

    Bruce

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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Two completely different aircraft so relax. The FAA probably had a perfectly good reason for refusing the airworthiness certificate issuance. The reason behind it should be included in the press release. Criquet seemed to waste no time in removing their website (which is currently down) so I'm guessing that it was some major quality control issue and the company wasn't committed to a quality product if they aren't willing to stand and fight for it.
    Last edited by SVSUSteve; May 15th, 2012 at 02:38 PM.
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Quote Originally Posted by SVSUSteve View Post
    Two completely different aircraft so relax. The FAA probably had a perfectly good reason for refusing the airworthiness certificate issuance. The reason behind it should be included in the press release. Criquet seemed to waste no time in removing their website (which is currently down) so I'm guessing that it was some major quality control issue and the company wasn't committed to a quality product if they aren't willing to stand and fight for it.
    Or the international vendor simply didn't provide all the paperwork necessary to comply with the needs of the agency. May be as simple as that, or something more complex and objective.
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Quote Originally Posted by Topaz View Post
    Or the international vendor simply didn't provide all the paperwork necessary to comply with the needs of the agency. May be as simple as that, or something more complex and objective.
    The FAA would have just issued a temporary hold on further airworthiness certificates if it were simply a paperwork issue. A more serious issue is probably at hand here or the company realized that they weren't going to simply do as they damn well pleased and, to quote a song, "took the money and run" (apparently they bailed and never refunded deposits on ordered aircraft).

    Also, apparently this action took place the middle of last year so it's not anything new. Why is it just coming up now?

    Aero-News Alert: Is The FAA Cracking Down On LSA Manufacturers? | Aero-News Network

    Then the FAA won't comment ON WHY the Criquets have been banned.
    Yes, they did:
    "This memorandum prohibits the issuance of special flight permits, special light-sport aircraft (S-LSA) and experimental light-sport aircraft (E-LSA) airworthiness certificates to all Storch FI-156 airplanes manufactured by Criquet Aviation USA, Inc.
    "On July 13th 2011 , the Production and Airworthiness Division, AIR-200, conducted a prototype of a national light-sport aircraft audit program at U-Fly-It, LSA, LLC. The prototype audit results indicated that U-Fly-It LSA and Criquet Aviation USA were unable to demonstrate that the current manufacturing and re-assembly system for aircraft model Storch FI-156 is in compliance with all FAA accepted consensus standards and regulatory requirements. The FAA has determined that a potential safety of flight issue may exist with Storch FI-156 models manufactured by Criquet Aviation USA, Inc.










    "Effectively immediately, no Special Flight Permits, S-LSA or E-LSA airworthiness certificates will be issued to any Storch FI-156 airplane manufactured by Criquet Aviation USA, Inc., until further notice from AIR-200."
    Basically they were cutting corners and not following the standards they were being held to in such a way that it was considered a hazard to anyone who might ride in one.
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    While I realize the "Ban on Criquet Storches" is old news from last year-it is "New News" to me.

    Like I said in my original post, IF I am going to spend the time and money to build an aircraft and, of course, make sure I build it properly, I just want to be assured it will be SAFE with no "Design Defects."

    Any reports from people that have built or flown PL-9 Pazmany Storks would be very Welcome to me. The "closest thing" I have flown to a STOL airplane is a Cessna 150.

    THANKS EVERYONE FOR YOUR REPLIES SO FAR!

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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Quote Originally Posted by SVSUSteve View Post
    ...Yes, they did:


    Basically they were cutting corners and not following the standards they were being held to in such a way that it was considered a hazard to anyone who might ride in one.
    Ah. Okay, thanks for that. I hadn't seen it, obviously.
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Of all of the Storch replicas available, I would seriously consider Pazmany's version. Pazmany was reportedly very meticulous in his research and engineering of this aircraft. I have not seen the plans for the Storch specifically, but I have been impressed by the level of detail in his other plans that I have seen.

    Pazmany wasn't exactly an amateur. He was an accomplished engineer on military aircraft and missile systems in addition to his homebuilts. Little projects like this:
    Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork  & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???-f106_delta_dart.jpg
    Pazmany taught engineering and wrote several books as well. He received an AIAA award for technical excellence, an August Raspet award, and is in the EAA hall of fame. In short, this guy knew what he was doing. I wouldn't have any concerns about his aircraft being unsafe.

    The only knock I know of on Pazmany was that his aircraft had a reputation as being slow to build. The joke with his earlier, sheet metal aircraft was that "Pazmany" translated as "many parts." (Keep in mind this was also before the days of comprehensive kits, much less the quick build variety.) The Storch is built in an entirely different manner, so I don't know if that same criticism would apply.

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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    The PL9 is not an LSA.

    PL9 is easy to fly, cant speak to the criquet although I expect its the same. PL9 plans are very good, and yes if you build it in compliance with the FAA rules they should approve it.

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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Quote Originally Posted by cnctube View Post
    The PL9 is not an LSA.

    PL9 is easy to fly, cant speak to the criquet although I expect its the same. PL9 plans are very good, and yes if you build it in compliance with the FAA rules they should approve it.
    The problem isn't with the homebuilders building Pazmany's model. The problem (and "ban") is with regards to the commercial production of a variant of the Storch.

    Pazmany taught engineering and wrote several books as well. He received an AIAA award for technical excellence, an August Raspet award, and is in the EAA hall of fame. In short, this guy knew what he was doing. I wouldn't have any concerns about his aircraft being unsafe.
    In even shorter: the guy was an engineering badass.
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR YOUR REPLIES!!!!

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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    I have just purchased plans for the PL-9 Storch and there are no outstanding issues of any kind. Buy your plans, build your plane, and have years of fun.
    Ian



    Quote Originally Posted by Southron View Post
    O.K. I understand that the FAA has, in effect, "BANNED" the Criquet "Storch" LSA. My understanding is that the fuselage was manufactured in South America, imported into the U.S. and the LSA finished in Florida.

    The FAA did an "Audit?" of the company in Florida and came out with the ruling that in the future, no Air Worthiness Certificates would issued for Criquets. In the meantime, the FAA DID NOT revoke the Air Worthiness certificate of the 3 Criquet Storches now flying.

    Then the FAA won't comment ON WHY the Criquets have been banned.

    MY QUESTION:

    If I purchase a set of plans for the Pazmany PL-9 Stork and build such an aircraft, following all FAA rules, etc...would the FAA approve it for flight?

    The Pazmany PL-9 is, in effect, identical to the banned Criquet Storch.

    ALSO......................................

    Is anyone familiar with ANY "Safety Issues" with the Pazmany PL-9 Stork?

    THANKS!!!!!

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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    I have just bought plans for the PL-9 storch through Aircraft Spruce. There are no issues with the plans or building the airplane. Buy your plans, build your aircraft, and have years of fun.

    Ian

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    Registered User SVSUSteve's Avatar
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    Re: Pazmanyt PL-9 Stork & The FAA Criquet "Storch" Ban???

    Just out curiosity, how much the full set of plans cost you?
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