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Thread: engine for CH-801

  1. #1
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    engine for CH-801

    Doing some more looking while it rains. What's the maximum size and HP that will fit? To obtain maximum short field performance. Ignore fuel consumption and range right now.

    Can the new HD model handle the extra HP?

    From Zenith website. Engine maximum weight 440lb. 150-240 HP

    I know there are lots of options.


    Looking at the IO-580 444 lb 315HP Lycoming IO-580 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    TIO-540 438 lb 400HP 400+hp Lycoming TIO-540 by Sky Dynamics - YouTube


    dry weight, slightly more in service.

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    Registered User cluttonfred's Avatar
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    Honestly, if the manufacturer states 240hp max, then I'd not go much over that, Chris Heinz is a professional aero engineer of long experience. Personally, I might look at something like a modest Ford or Chevrolet crate engine of around 300 hp to swing a big prop through a redrive. By derating down to 240 hp you'd have a very economical, long lasting and relatively fuel-efficient engine at the max horsepower for your airframe. You could even go with a more powerful, high-torque model that puts out more horses at low RPM and run it direct drive through a rubber torsional damper in a bell housing for the prop. Here are some possible candidates, click on the specific models and the dyno graphs for power info. But an auto engine conversion is a big job, depends how much you want to bite off. Cheers, Matthew

    http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_new/mc/crate_engines/chevy_sbc.shtm

    PS--There's an auto conversion CH801 on the Belted Air Power homepage http://www.beltedair.com/ and another one in the gallery.
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    I would not go over either. His designs dont seem to be overbuilt. Most engine weights are sans accessories so add another 50-70 depending. Also going with a IO-390 has the potential of having a lower ramp weight for more load. If you have to have a 6 then a stock 0-540 narrow deck about 70 lbs lighter overall over a angle valve.

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    Registered User rv6ejguy's Avatar
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    Quote Originally Posted by reubenT View Post
    Doing some more looking while it rains. What's the maximum size and HP that will fit? To obtain maximum short field performance. Ignore fuel consumption and range right now.

    Can the new HD model handle the extra HP?

    From Zenith website. Engine maximum weight 440lb. 150-240 HP

    I know there are lots of options.


    Looking at the IO-580 444 lb 315HP Lycoming IO-580 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    TIO-540 438 lb 400HP 400+hp Lycoming TIO-540 by Sky Dynamics - YouTube


    dry weight, slightly more in service.
    These engines will cost more than the kit I believe. Ben Haas who is on here, did a nice Ford V8 installation in his Zenith.
    Ross Farnham
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    The -580 would be too heavy.

    Remember the 440lbs isn't just a bare engine - that has to include all the other accessories. Everything you hang in front of the firewall counts, otherwise you risk being out of balance.

    An IO-540-A, -D, etc runs about 450lbs once everything's installed around it. But, you can easily get 290hp from one of those without the crazy turbo which you dont need. If it were me, I'd go for 260hp as your engine is going to last a lot longer and is more likely to make TBO and beyond. The thrust case is too small on the -A, -D etc series block for 290hp, and they are known to wear our early. You need a -K block for the 290hp, if you want it to last, but the -K block is 50lbs heavier with the meatier thrust case.... No free lunch here sorry!
    Bearhawk kit no.125

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    Re: engine for CH-801

    Gday Chaps ,is it just me or is anyone else picturing an 801 with a rotec 2800 round thing in front.Bit down in power but would look so cool!! Cheers Ross

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    Registered User Matt G.'s Avatar
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    Quote Originally Posted by Rosco View Post
    Gday Chaps ,is it just me or is anyone else picturing an 801 with a rotec 2800 round thing in front.Bit down in power but would look so cool!! Cheers Ross
    R3600 is 150hp, that would probably be a better choice...
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    Quote Originally Posted by Rosco View Post
    Gday Chaps ,is it just me or is anyone else picturing an 801 with a rotec 2800 round thing in front.Bit down in power but would look so cool!! Cheers Ross
    Well one thing is for sure - it certainly couldn't make the plane any uglier........!
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    Bearhawk kit no.125

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    Registered User stol's Avatar
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    Re: engine for CH-801

    I am very close to 400 HP on my 801 and personally it is on a dangerous side at full throttle... I have 500 hours and about 100,000 miles on it and no off field landing, crashes or other major disasters..... Redrive has needed improvement and trying to get the EGT's to 1775f killed a piston, altho for 300 hours it ran at 1725f... I am not sure the auto fuel I ran that day was not mis marked at the pump, labeled 91 octane but my guess it was total crap.. Now a days I run 75% 91 mo gas and 25% 100LL to boost the octane in case the auto fuel vendor is a liar..

    As for weight.. I am right at 437lbs firewall forward.. and I need 38 lbs in the tail to get it to balance, but keep in mind the builders who install the Franklin 220 hp need to add 32 lbs back there... Also those published weights of aircraft engines are TOTALLY misleading... I personally removed a COMPLETE 0-360 Lyc with a constant speed 2 blade prop, I mean everything needed for it to run like fuel system, exhaust system, baffles, starter, alternator, mags etc, etc,etc.... In weighed 456 lbs... Your 6 cylinder that claims 440 lbs will end up close to 600 when all is said and done... WAY too much for a 801.... Take this info for what you paid for it... 0.00...<G>engine for CH-801-enginetopfromright.jpgengine for CH-801-picture_204.jpgengine for CH-801-piston_failure_001.jpgengine for CH-801-801-cabin-028.jpg

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    Re: engine for CH-801

    Rotec 2900!!! now that would look different. Might it look better in a bike? JRL's Rotec R2800 powered chopper.

    Thanks for all the info. I have ways of cutting down fuel use, so a big engine isn't a problem there. I'm thinking the biggest engine - highest HP that it can handle, in weight and torque, will reduce approach speed and shorten the landing roll. As well as quicken liftoff.

    I have this mental picture that if you put a big enough engine in an airplane, it would eliminate stall, you could reduce the airspeed, let the tail drop, and do an in air tail stand. And if landing short is the need, do that just above ground, set it down by slowly reducing engine speed, and then lay it down on it's wheels gently as it rolls forward a bit. Extreme example. But what I see stunt planes doing is almost that capable. Like a little single place biplane with a big engine. I was looking at one once that had 360HP, where with normal flying 80 might be enough. I suppose the 801 airframe isn't strong enough, and balanced, to handle that much engine. So we'll do what works best.

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